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New to creating games.

Discussion in 'Community Chat' started by GamerTurnip, Jan 30, 2017.

  1. GamerTurnip

    GamerTurnip Guest

    Good morning all,

    So basically I've had an idea in my head for creating a game for around 6 months now, I've tried shaking it off as I'm clueless when it comes to coding etc but I just can't get it out of my head.

    Now I know it takes a lot of time and dedication to get anywhere but I'm at a point where I'm just bored of the current games that's out there so want to dedicate my spare time to something more satisfying and there's where I came across GameMaker(google) and it looks perfect for what I'm hoping to create one day. Obviously I'd like to attempt something like asteroids or something simple first.

    I have a couple of questions if anyone has a spare moment though please:

    - The free studio download, what exactly am I not getting with this version apart from selling on market place and using on mobile? If I was to create a semi-decent game on the free version could I then upgrade to another?

    - Is there any books on GameMaker, if so could you suggest a good starter?

    Thank you for your time! :)
     
  2. Bingdom

    Bingdom Googledom

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    Depends on what gms version you use
    1.4
    Cannot change splash screen and a few functions are unavailable, and a few others. Shouldn't affect beginner gamedev much. If I remember correctly, you can release your games on steam if you wanted too, without paying a license.
    2.0
    Not sure if lifted, but I think there limitations on the amount of objects, scripts sprites you can use. Cannot export project to exe I think.

    I don't have experience with reading gms tut books, but based on their YT tutorials, either heartbeast or Shaun Spaulding (or both) provides books that look fairly decent. I think they are a bit outdated and may be confusing if you are using gms2 for them although.
     
  3. GamerTurnip

    GamerTurnip Guest

    That's great, thanks for your time Bingdom.
     
  4. Perseus

    Perseus Not Ragarnak Forum Staff Moderator

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    Hi there and welcome to the GMC! :)

    1. There are some Helpdesk articles about the limitations of the free version(s) of the product(s) that you might be interested in checking out.

    GM:S 1.4:
    http://help.yoyogames.com/hc/en-us/articles/216754968-Which-Version-Of-GameMaker-Studio-Is-For-Me-

    GMS 2:
    http://help.yoyogames.com/hc/en-us/articles/230407528-GameMaker-Studio-2-Trial-Limitations

    As for loading projects made using the free version, you can definitely open them with a paid version if you ever decide to upgrade.

    2. I have never used books for GM personally. But some dedicated members of the community have compiled a list of all the famous GameMaker books, which can be found here:
    https://forum.yoyogames.com/index.php?threads/948/

    Note that since GMS 2 changes a lot of things, using GM:S 1.4 books would confuse you even further. If you want to use 1.4, then it's fine. But if you want to learn GMS 2, I'd suggest dropping the thought of books for now. Use the built-in tutorials and the tutorials meant for GMS 2 instead.
     
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  5. gn.fur

    gn.fur Member

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    Free GMS should be more than enough for you for first couple of years. I also don't recommend GMS2, it is still very raw and unpolished (and also has a lot of limitations in free version), it's better to wait untill Yoyo'll make it usable.

    And for learning material just press F1 in GMS.
     
    RichHopefulComposer likes this.
  6. GamerTurnip

    GamerTurnip Guest

    Thanks I'm just in the process of installing the free version from Steam although I'm not totally sure what that version is just yet but thought I'd check it out anyway.

    Edit - Just done the first tutorial "Catch the Clown" and created my first game yay! Pretty satisfying, installing and playing it. Although super basic it was good fun :)
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 30, 2017
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  7. gn.fur

    gn.fur Member

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    I'll advise to download GMS 1.4 from site. Steam version has update delays and some other crap.
     
  8. Nocturne

    Nocturne Friendly Tyrant Forum Staff Admin

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    Umm... Okay, so GMS1.4 is nearing it's end of life and when 2.0 comes out of beta it's being discontinued (although essential support will continue for the foreseeable future). The general consensus is that 2.0 is FAR more stable and far nicer to use than 1.4 and it's also got a number of new features and improvements. I would NOT recommend getting 1.4 at this point simply because you will have to change at some point, and when you do you'll have to go through a bit of a learning curve again... People are already using it to create large projects (look at the awesome Nikra) and while it has a few issues, they are being worked on and updates are fast and constant.

    In general, when it comes to technology, always get the latest if your pocket can permit it.
     
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  9. Cpaz

    Cpaz Member

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    For the time being, i'd wait and try things like getting the basic idea of said game down on paper (probably "virtual paper" as it were) then investing in GMS2 on its release.
    As GMS 1.4 will be free with standard (not free) GMS2 on release. I'd say you would try the trial once it's released to get the general feel of how it will be.
     
  10. RichHopefulComposer

    RichHopefulComposer Member

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    You say that, but there are MOUNTAINS of tutorials for 1.x out there, and the free version is actually viable for making complete games in. I think either are good choices right now.

    It's not like it's hard to learn GMS2 after learning the basics of GM. And you say GMS2 is stable, but I'm still seeing a decent amount of threads about significant bugs in the program, which makes sense, since it's still in Beta. It'd be pretty sad if we couldn't recommend 1.x on the grounds of stability when its been out for so long, right?

    GMS2 is more enjoyable to use for me, but it seems like they're still hashing out what its final form will be. I'm not sure I'd want to use a beta product with barely any public tutorials for learning purposes, heheh.
     
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  11. gn.fur

    gn.fur Member

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    You killed convenient windows, replaced them with those horrible workspaces noone asked for, and telling they're nicer to use. Awesome. ( - :
    But ok, let's pretend they're at least as usable as windows in GMS1.
    As I remember, free GMS has all the features except of ports to other platforms and a couple on minor things newbie shouln't care about. What we have with GMS2? 15 objects, 20 sprites, 10 scripts. I'll remind you, he's newbie, he knows basically nothing about Gamemaker and gamedev, newbies love to spawn objects like crazy. Menu button? Object! Cloud it the sky? Object! My first game had at least 30 of them. He won't be able to make complete game with such strict limitations. So why should he waste his money on product he's not sure in?
    Right now the best option for him is picking up GMS1, try its almost full functionality and only then consider if it is his thing or not. And this will be actual for newbies at least for next couple of years.
    And GMS isn't differs that much from GMS2 (except of terrible interface). So transition from one to another won't be painful when time will come (we are still pretending GMS2 has good interface, remember?).

    Also, GMS1 still awaits long, long life. I see loads and loads of people who use GM8.0 to this day. Of course, I'm highly questioning their intelligence, but fact is fact.
     
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2017
  12. Nocturne

    Nocturne Friendly Tyrant Forum Staff Admin

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    This whole post smacks of entitlement. Why should a "newbie" have to make a full game? The trial version is just that, a TRIAL. If they test it and like it then they can buy it. If they can't afford to buy it then they don't. You get to test drive a car for free, but the guy in the garage doesn't say, "sure, keep it for as long as you like and when you're ready to buy and it has 1000000 miles on the clock just let us know". No, you test drive the car for 10 minutes and then if you like it you buy it if you can.

    Just because YOU do not like the workspace paradigm does not mean that everyone hates it or it's no good. It has some teething problems? Yes, but then what new product doesn't. More people were screaming for a new IDE for previous versions of GM than anything else so that's what we've got and in every single area it's been rewritten and improved. You do not have access to all the feedback data so please stop talking as if you do.

    Yeah, that's one of the hills that YYG has to climb. However this HAD to happen if GM were to progress. GMS1.4 was built off of a legacy IDE that was really showing it's age, and while most of the codebase had been re-written, it was being held back by the way it integrated with the IDE. So, to improve GML, and to improve performance, and also to enable the addition of future features easily, the decision was made to ditch the aging delphi UI and start afresh. This permits us to focus on making the IDE and codebase as independent as possible (which is why RunTimes and IDE are now separate entities) which in turn means the faster (and simpler) addition of features as well as the improvement of GML etc... So, yeah, leaving a small void in the tutorials was a necessary evil to get a bigger benefit down the road.

    Note though that a large part of previous tutorials will still work in GMS2, and we will be producing more tutorials for the IDE too, and I have no doubt that the awesome GM community will soon fill the void with user submissions... I suppose it could be looked on as a real opportunity for those that are willing to get in early and create tutorial books, videos and blogs. Filling that void now could be a great chance to get noticed... :)
     
    Last edited: Feb 1, 2017
  13. gn.fur

    gn.fur Member

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    It is a very common thing when people make a game or two and then lose interest in gamedev. And if you have an option to try full functionality for free, even only for previous version, I can't see any reasons why you shoudn't.
    GMS won't lose its actuality at least for next 2-3 years and has much more soft trial policy, so why not try it first?

    That's why in my message I pretended it's good. I know there are people who liked new IDE. For some mysterious reason.
    But yes, IDE in GMS1 is laggy and glitchy. Of couse people would ask to fix those things.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 1, 2017
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  14. Nocturne

    Nocturne Friendly Tyrant Forum Staff Admin

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    Because there is no impetus for you to buy it then and I'd like to eat this month? If you are serious about making games, then you will buy it and you'll make games, if you are not serious then you won't EVER buy it, so why should we work hard for free to give you a load of great tools to play with? Sorry, but this whole "give me everything for free because I want it" attitude that is prevalent in a lot of circles just annoys me. NOTHING in life is free, and to expect YYG to work on a product just to give it away is just mean. The Trial version gives you more than enough depth for you to explore the IDE and make a few things and then see if the product is for you. If it is, you buy. If it's not, you move on.
     
  15. gn.fur

    gn.fur Member

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    But you are giving GMS1 for free (except of ports) by yourself. So that means you are ok if somebody will take this free GMS and will never buy it. You made it free, not me, what's the problem?
     
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  16. RichHopefulComposer

    RichHopefulComposer Member

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    Nocturne...no offense, but what the heck are you on about? gn.fur isn't asking for anything for free. OP asked for the best option for him to download, and gn.fur was kind enough to let him know what he thought HIS best option was. 1.x's free version is infinitely better than GMS2's. There's no getting around that.

    I've heard "we're not a God damned charity!" from Yoyo staff a lot lately. Here's a pro-tip: we users aren't a charity either. If you want to entice users to grab the GMS2 demo, then make that demo better for the user. If someone asks me what their better option to learn games with is, I'm not going to lie to them and point them to 2.0 to help you eat this month. I know you guys have like two years worth of ramen and baked beans in the back, anyway. You're not fooling anyone with your sob stories. :p

    Alternative plan: if you don't want people jumping onto 1.x because of its superior free version, but you want to keep GMS2's free version the way it is to encourage people to actually buy copies, then why not re-limit the free version of 1.x? You can't offer a product for free and then get mad when people use it, haha! X'D
     
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  17. Pyxus

    Pyxus Member

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    If you're looking for a book, i'd recommend heart beast's book http://www.heartbeast.co/book
     
  18. GMWolf

    GMWolf aka fel666

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    I have to agree: if you are new to Game maker, the free version of GMs1.4 is the way to go.
    However, if you are gonna buy GM, I would strongly recommend buying GMS2.
    80%+ of GMS1.4 tutorials cab easily be implemented using GMS2, and the number of GMS2 tutorials is bound to grow.
     
  19. Alessio

    Alessio Guest

    I'd really wait for the new GM:S2. I'm waiting for it too but i'm already fed up of it, heh. But i'd rather use a good tool rather than a rushed one.
    Since i want to start a real project, i'm waiting for the new version, which isn't an upgrade but a totally new tool. But if you feel like using GM:S1 for training purpose, you can definitely do it, but i'd really wait for GM:S2 for a real project.

    I've got two books for GML: GameMaker Game Programming with GML and Game Maker Cookbook.
    GameMaker Game Programming with GML: can be good if you want to train with GML and feel more skilled aftermath but the book is kind of liar when it says "it's for complete beginners" because if you are, you'll get lost soon, since it's very complex. Also, while the first section, where you'll build a Candy Crush clone, is fine, the second one, where you'll build a simple platformer, is, sorry for it, quite bad because it tells how to build a platformer in a way you aren't supposed to, but has some few but very useful codes. But, really, i feel that the author, even if they were a good GML user, had no idea of what beginner need to learn GML and beginners may, i repeat, may, not will, get lost and feel stuck.

    Game Maker Cookbook: it's nothing more than a collections of codes and tricks. It's not a real tutorial per se but it may actually be useful.

    I have not read it, but, for beginners, Game Maker Essentials may be useful too.

    Please, no. No, i don't want to be a jerk and discourage people from buying books for the lulz of it but that book is very bad. When i got that book (luckly, it was on sale for the PDF version), i thought it would really be a good guide but i was wrong because the sections from n.1 to n.10 don't tell anything that isn't written more in depth and better in the YoYo's official docs and the rest of the book is... well, quite useless. When i was finished with the book, i realized i didn't learn anything at all. While i'm still a beginner, i could learn all the things i've learnt by trying, trying again, looking at examples and trying to understand them. At this point i'd look for some free tutorails on the Web or look for other more specific books, but not that book. I may annoy someone with these words but i feel the main reason many users recommend the book is because they already have learnt stuff and have no idea of how beginners feel when they feel lost with GML programming. Only because the author does popular video tutorials doesn't mean their book is awesome.

    In any case, only the OP will decide what to do, like i and most do. This is democracy.

    Why do you care so much? Also, according to you, it's like everyone will lose interest in gamedev because they try multiple tools before deciding what's the better one for them. That's just... no.

    I hate strawberries, really. But i know there are people who like strawberries. For some mysterious reason... no, really, what? This is really entitlement. :(
     
  20. gn.fur

    gn.fur Member

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    GMS2 is only beta right now. I'm sure Yoyo will improve IDE and make it at least usable. So until then I won't bash its interface as much.

    I never said such thing. Many people will quit shortly after, yes. But not everybody.
     
  21. Alessio

    Alessio Guest

    At this point there isn't even any need to point that out. If some people quit gamedev, that's not your problem.
     
  22. Chris S.

    Chris S. Guest

    Check out these YouTubers: Shaun Spalding, HeartBeast, Making Games 101. Their tutorials really helped me!
     
  23. FrostyCat

    FrostyCat Member

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    A lot of people around here recommend watching videos to get started, but I see everyday how the way they used them isn't working. The next time they run into the slightest hitch, all they could do is type "how to do XYZ" on YouTube. It's bound to fail at some point, and it's amateurish.

    If you want to start by watching videos, fine, but here are my tips for making the best out of them:
    • Read over the first half of the Manual's Reference -> GML Language Overview section before watching your first video. You can't possibly derive any real context if you don't know the basic building blocks of the language.
    • Watch one at a time without "multi-tasking", and no more than 3 episodes or 30 minutes (whichever is shorter) in a row. You need time and focus to absorb the material, and you need to learn to be deliberate about your learning.
    • Have the Manual open while the video is on, and pause for a lookup whenever you see something new. This is a habit that you should carry everywhere with you, whether you are watching a video, reading instructions or writing code.
    • Write down at least 10 reusable patterns from every tutorial you watch. Everything you write down here must be widely applicable enough to be untraceable back to a definite genre, feature or title. This forces you to analyze what you watched and trains you to be resourceful. You can also write down things that you recognize from previous sessions but are used another way. Be honest and pass on things that are too trivial for your level.
    • After watching a tutorial series, you must make a proof-of-concept that doesn't look anything like the tutorial, based on what you learned. This forces you to go beyond blind copying --- 100% doable if you wrote down genuinely reusable techniques.
    • Until you are done making the proof-of-concept, you cannot watch any other tutorial or ask any closed-ended questions on the GMC. You must allow yourself to be tested on your resourcefulness and your grasp of the material. That tutorial is always there for you to rewind and rewatch if you don't remember all of it the first time. But at some point you must take something with you for future projects.

    And you must NEVER allow yourself to buy excuses like "I can't read the Manual because I'm a visual learner" or "I won't double-check my code because I'm dyslexic". Psychologists and pedagogues coined and researched these terms to help people who genuinely need their aid, not for people who don't to use as a crutch.

    I'd like novices to start trying the method I described above and see what difference it makes to the usual "video-driven" learning process. For once I am giving tutorial video watchers a chance to redeem themselves --- make me proud.
     
  24. GMWolf

    GMWolf aka fel666

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    I totally agree with all of the above.

    I make videos myself (GMWolf on YouTube) and all I see is people who blindly copy down code and complain about it not working. Not giving it a second of though as to how the code is supposed to work.
    Worse: I spend a lit of time helping people who are following my videos, only to find they forgot a parenthesis or a bracket. That is incredibly lazy, and simply shows they wanted code to copy down, not to learn how to code.
    There is no excuse for that.

    This is one of the reasons I am moving to more videos that explain general concepts and patterns with minimal code rather than the "make an RPG" sort of series.

    In actual fact, I find the "make an RPG" kind of series quite unhelpful, as 3/4 of the code is specific to that project, and will not help you at all. Then the other 1/4 is often hard to identify. How can you tell what is a pattern and what isnt?

    @FrostyCat s guidelines seem extreme, but they will work very, very well. I agree that this is the best way to follow video material.
    However don't be afraid, you don't have to be so methodical about it. Just make sure you don't fall into the traps frosty described.

    As to what videos to follow- as mentioned before, I would avoid the longer series an how to make a specific game. They are too specific and include a lot of single use code. They also are very unhelpful when it comes to learning concepts.
    Shorter videos explaining patters, concepts, or algorithms and techniques are far better, as you will only get the bare minimum code needed to understand a concept. Ready for you to understand and implement in your own test project.

    Finally: use the manual. GM has one of the best manuals. It is the first place you should go before you google it.
    Chances are, you will get your answer, along with some code to get you started.
     
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  25. Annoyed Grunt

    Annoyed Grunt Member

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    No? You don't invest in a new hobby. You first get invested in the hobby (pun intended) then you invest in it. If somebody tells you "I'd like to race, but I don't know how to drive well" you don't tell him "BUY A FERRARI NOW OR YOU ARE NOT SERIOUS".

    Also nobody is asking you to give them anything for free, because the free stuff is already there to be used.

    This guy doesn't need to "explore the IDE", he needs to explore the complete idea of making games. He can't do that by using an incomplete piece of software that is not only arcane to him, but also actively limiting.
     
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  26. Chris S.

    Chris S. Guest

    If you actually pay attention to what the code in the video DOES, it helps apply to other situations -- nothing very amateurish about that. If you need a book, I'd say use the code reference.
     
  27. GMWolf

    GMWolf aka fel666

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    The problem is that people don't tend to do that.
    Trust me, well over 1/2 of the comments on my most popular video all ask about the very same problem.
    A problem they should very easily be able to solve if they stopped to think about just what the code is doing.
     
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  28. Chris S.

    Chris S. Guest

    OK, I see your point. People are lazy. ;)
     
  29. Alyxx

    Alyxx Member

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    I am using GMS 1.4 for my own big project and have no plans to upgrade to GMS 2 until I absolutely have to since I'll have to relearn a bit and figure out the new interface and such, so I'm hopefully saving that for my next projects.
    Besides, it's still beta so no point in upgrading yet.
    I also recommend buying GMS if you plan on releasing any games. It's not that expensive and it's worth the investment if you ever make a game you want to actually publish.
     
  30. GMWolf

    GMWolf aka fel666

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    Though you do get 1.4 if you buy 2 at the moment.
    I also think 2 is fit for releasing games. Many people have migrated their commercial projects to it, and some even started in GMS2 and are being release, check out nykra.
    I'm my experience, the windows platform has been very stable. No bugs have come between me and development.
     
  31. Niels

    Niels Member

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    Few tips from another dev(me) that started out without any former knowedge/skills.

    1. Skip the drag and drop and go learn GML... trust me, you will thank me later.
    2. Don't start out with spending money on books and lessons... the manual that comes with gm:studio (F1 from within the game), together with YouTube lessons (from shaun spalding, heartbeast, mk2dev, pixelatedPope) and this forum will pull you trough:)
    3. For your first few projects avoid things like 3D, inventories, leveling systems, procedural generated content, or isometric projection,
    4. Instead focus on movement, collisions, and controls.
    5. Start out with really small projects, don't fall in the beginners trap of wanting to make a epic rpg as first project.
    6. Don't be afraid to ask help... heartbeast said in a video that if you are stuck for more than 1 hour on 1 feature, go ask help:)

    Hope that helps you getting started:)
     
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