GMC Jam Discussion GMC Jam 31 / XXXI / Discussion

Discussion in 'GMC Jam' started by NAL, Sep 26, 2018.

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  1. Misu

    Misu The forum's immigrant

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    Not me...

    Im using the most hours i can within this range! Bring it on 10 days!
     
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  2. mimusic

    mimusic Member

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    edit: well looking back through the comments it seems like there's a lot more individuals who would really prefer the 10 day format :x I must admit, I'm personally way more likely to join in if I have 10 days to do it... I just hope it doesn't severely throw off the quality balance across entries. That came across as way more negative and concerned than I meant. I have full confidence this Jam will generate a lot of great entries and open the event to people who otherwise wouldn't participate.
    10 days would allow the more casual hobbyists and working folk to make legitimate entries, but it would also give those with more free time a great advantage. All the participants who are used to finishing up in 3 days would now have a lot more time to polish, expand on core ideas, and possibly work themselves into burnout. I'm into both 3 days and month-long for their own reasons, but 10 days just seems like it would only greatly benefit a subset of participants.

    For the GMC Jams in particular, 3 days feels adequate. Places like itch.io have longer jams for those who want more time or are only free during evenings.

    Otherwise, for the GM-specific aspect of these jams, I might just lightly recommend another jam on the forums with a longer timeline but no prizes. This way, nobody's really disadvantaged by a shorter/longer timeline, but people still get to come together over GameMaker.
     
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2018
  3. dadio

    dadio Potato Overlord Forum Staff Moderator

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    I imagine it will "severely throw off the quality balance" because some people will use the full 10 days (whereas I suspect *most* people will only use 3 or 4 days). It may make judging entries and deciding winners more tricky, but it's worth it to be able to do this thing over weekdays or days not stacked back to back. And I think it's going to be interesting seeing what those few people do with all those extra days (longer games? more polish? more focus on sound/music/mood?) In theory, this Jam should produce more games, better quality and more variety. I like that we're also keeping the "3 possible Themes" change from last time, meaning not many (if any) people will have a valid excuse for not entering (10 days is a long enough stretch to have at least 1 day free, and 3 Themes mean it's not likely that you find at least 1 of them interesting.) Hafta say, personally I'm looking forward to this next GMCJam more than I have for many years.

    PS: If there are genuine concerns about quality balance/judging games this time round, it might be an idea for entrants to clearly state how much time they put in? That might help. Personally tho, my judging focus will still be 1. Does it make creative use of the Theme? and 2. Gameplay. (Something I'd be a lot more conerned about this Jam, is some people maybe entering longer/more polished games that they had created beforehand, and just doing some "reskinning" to count as following the Theme. So yeah, "creative Theme use" is gonna be even more important than usual for me this time when reviewing/judging.)
     
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  4. Misu

    Misu The forum's immigrant

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    I wonder what will Dadio make in 10 days...
     
  5. HayManMarc

    HayManMarc Member

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    My guess: Spankin' New Pun'kins
     
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  6. sylvain_l

    sylvain_l Member

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    hum... unbalance is already a thing.
    you already have team vs one person.
    you already have professional game dev vs. hobbyist.
    you already have participant that can only put a few hours in due to life vs. other who can spend the whole weekend.
    so IMO going from the 3 days format to 10 days isn't like you are introducing a factor that's not already in.

    I just hope it offer more opportunity for more participants to give it a shot.
     
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  7. mimusic

    mimusic Member

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    yeah i dont disagree with that lol, I'm not that worried about it. My tone came off stronger than I meant

    I get the impression people thought I was being negative about the change. It was really just a passing thought, a moment of playing devil's advocate, as I'm positive this jam will bring more and better entries than previous jams, and opens up the event to a lot of people who wouldn't otherwise want to or be able to take part (including myself)
     
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  8. NAL

    NAL ʕ ᓀ ᴥ ᓂ ʔ Moderator GMC Elder

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    The main topic is now up, and here is the first clue to the three themes!

    [​IMG]
     
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  9. Misu

    Misu The forum's immigrant

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    Full discussion so soon?

    Woooooooooooooooooooo!!!

    Hype hype hype!

    EDIT: i got your clue... Sort of...

    E = 4;
    P = 8;
    A = 8;
    S = 3;
    Y = 9;
    B = 5;

    Im wondering of these represent the position of those letters within its theme word. The question is, which letter goes to which word?
    Ill have to find out...
    Oh nevermind i realize that they represent word lengths. Ok so I get it now
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2018 at 4:38 PM
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  10. GVmG

    GVmG Rainfall

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    wait it's already jam time? well, almost

    I'm in.

    EDIT: Aaaand, I solved it. WARNING: brute force, because screw systems of equations.

    Step 1, P=A. This means that E^2 will always be 2N where N is something (either A or P, both are the same).

    So, let's see what N can be, and what the resulting values would be for E, from 1 to 9 (because that's what the image says is the range):
    Code:
    N   result (E)
    1   √2 = 1.41421356237... (this isn't even rational, let alone integer)
    2   √4 = 2
    3   √6 = 2.44948974278...
    4   √8 = 2.82842712475...
    5   √10= 3.16227766017...
    6   √12= 3.46410161514...
    7   √14= 3.74165738677...
    8   √16= 4
    9   √18= 4.24264068712...
    
    We can suppose that E will be an integer, I doubt a letter will appear only partially.

    So now we are left with either A, P and E are all equal to 2, or P=A=8 and E=4. I'm guessing the latter, I doubt they'd only appear twice each across all three themes.

    Step 2, but let's be pessimistic and suppose that both P, E and A only appear twice each, across all three themes. Let's take a look at the other equations, reordered so that they look neater:
    Y=S^2, P=S+B, Y=E+B

    Let's look at that second one: replacing what we know, we have 2=S+B. That would mean that both S=B=1. Therefore Y=E+B=2+1=3. And this is wrong, because that would mean that the first equation would turn out to be 3=1^2. And we know 3 is definitely not equal to 1.

    Step 3, so maybe it was good to be pessimistic: let's suppose P=A=8 and E=4, and follow the same logic:
    8=S+B -> B=8-S

    Let's move that into the last equation: Y=E+B=4+(8-S). And since we know Y=S^2, let's replace that too: S^2=4+8-S. That's 12-S.

    That means S=√(12-S), and if we solve this (I'll spare you the actual operations) we get S=3. Let's plug that into B and Y, and we have B=5 and Y=9. So, let's see if we were luckier this time, and look at our results:
    S=3, P=A=8, E=4, B=5, Y=9.

    Final check, back to the original five equations:
    E^2=P+A -> 16=8+8 checks out
    P=A ->8=8 yeah, makes sense
    E+B=Y -> 4+5=9 yup
    S+B=P ->3+5=8 correct
    S^2=Y -> 3^2=9 indeed

    So in the end, we know the letter S appears 3 times, the letter P and A appear 8 times each, the letter E appears 4 times, the letter B appears 5 times, and the letter Y appears a grand total of 9 times.

    EDIT2: as usual I'm late and I didn't read the last messages, @Misu already solved it. I even misread what it was supposed to mean. welp I just wasted the night lmao
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2018 at 2:13 AM
  11. NAL

    NAL ʕ ᓀ ᴥ ᓂ ʔ Moderator GMC Elder

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    Values are correct, but you're missing a (GameMaker-related) piece of the puzzle so you're using/interpreting them incorrectly!
     
  12. Yal

    Yal Member GMC Elder

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    If that's true, that's some The Seventh Guest levels of wordplay if I've ever seen it. :p (The infamous soup can puzzle, if nobody knows what I'm talking about)

    Also "you're missing a GM-related clue" is in itself a really interesting hint...
     
  13. samspade

    samspade Member

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    I got the same result Misu did. But what does the other clue mean? "The number of letters showcased in each theme word"? Also does What am I? have any specific meaning? Or is it just asking what is the theme?

    Also you can unscramble the letters to be a couple different words such as Be A Spy and ESP Bay. :)
     
  14. IndianaBones

    IndianaBones Member

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    The number of letters showcased in each theme word...that's an interesting turn of phrase...is there a link to the YoYo games showcase page perhaps?

    Either that or the fact that Game Maker strings are indexed starting at 1...so you need to add 1 to all your answers... :)
     
  15. GVmG

    GVmG Rainfall

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    I mean, Y isn't that rare in English, I can see it appearing 9 times across three different multi-word themes.

    But yeah I doubt it's that because of the wording of the picture and because of the "GM-related clue".

    QuickEDIT: I'm guessing the first theme has 6 words that have that many letters, and the order depends on something GM-related.

    Maybe ABEPSY (alphabetical order), so the first theme would be
    XXXXXXXX XXXXX XXXX XXXXXXXX XXX XXXXXXXXX

    That'd be one long theme tho, and it's not GM-related.
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2018 at 7:54 PM
  16. Bentley

    Bentley Member

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    Amen to this. The short deadline is what forces you to focus on the essentials.
     
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