OFFICIAL GameMaker Studio 2 Version 2.3.6 Release & More

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Deleted member 16767

Guest
@gnysek I have made a grayscale shader which they call desaturation and I also have with help of Foxy's shader, made the option to make a blurry picture. It's not in the game maker level editor, but Shadowforge can do these stuffs for drawings and more will be added later. Pixelation I think Foxy has made, I'm not sure if he has released it in the marketplace. But I'm probably going to pick that up too. As you said, it can be done with shader code so for experienced users it's not really something that they desperately need.
 

gnysek

Member
we should hit up some shader devs
in fact it even doesn't require shader knowledge, I'm betting that all those fx_get_params() are just name of "uniforms" in shader, so u = shader_get_uniform() and shader_set_uniform_f(u, someval) is all that need to be added for most of filters to make them working not only on layers, but on objects too :D


I thought that 2.3.6 would also mean start of GXC portal, to see all those games published there, but seems that it wasn't connected (while GXC is visible on start page):
1635458177442.png
 

jonjons

Member
I don't want to derail this topic further, i was attempting to prevent from being derailed by encouraging everyone to talk about the cool new features and not what we don't like about x, y, or, z that is unrelated to the point of this thread. The things that aren't liked are related to the subscription model, and completely surround that, new features given to subscribed users, etc, its all the same thing. It's not liking the subscription model. To say you welcome the subscription model and don't like subs getting new features sooner is just a distracting away from the real thing you are upset about - and that's the subscription as a whole. if there was no subscription, the whole issue of "why can't i get what they get as soon as they do" wouldn't exist.

I feel like saying you welcome the subscription but don't like anything related to it is very self contradictory.

If you don't like yoyo's subscription GameMaker is not the only road to getting what you need to develop games. Everyone's acting like that's all they have to turn to and so they bug yoyo to give them what they want. You don't have to stay. I use multiple engines and languages, also write my own in c++ and have pleasantly discovered it is do-able for anyone who cares enough to do it. I don't like subscriptions either, but manipulating yoyo with moaning is just making the situation that's already bad worse if you ask me, for both us and for yoyo.

Let's try to be positive, please?
And yet... The same drama always happens.
GM has been getting all types of updates when it cames to code....
The truth is this stuff always gets unloaded on top of some visuals/graphics improvement... even if is just a new visual of the aplication (gm1.4 to gm2).
There cant be positive without negative, maybe a shift of the two.
Next time all the visuals improvements could be free ( paid version ), and the next wonderfull ds_grids, ds_lists, etc... would make everyone move on to the (subscription model)
But that would not work very well, since games are all about graphics/sound/music/gameplay/story... Not even AAA games mess with the code anymore
 

kburkhart84

Firehammer Games
Yeah I'm not looking for speculation here but for someone who can give me an official answer, whether it be they've tested it for themselves or they work for yoyo, etc.,
So you aren't going to address the actual reason I answered?!?! As I said, license mixing on teams is generally prohibitied. See the EULA.... That said, it specifically refers to exports, not these paywalled features....but don't be surprised if something changes at some point in the future. And even if they don't change it, it still says you can't export other people's content which technically could include these paywalled features.

3.7. Exporting Content. If you hold the appropriate level of GameMaker licence, you may export your Publisher Property to applicable third party platforms such as iOS and Ubuntu as permitted by us (further details can be found at www.yoyogames.com). You agree that any such exporting is at your own risk and may be subject to additional terms and conditions depending on the applicable third party platform, which we suggest you read carefully before exporting any content. In no circumstances are you permitted to export a third party's content or export your own content via a third party's GameMaker licence.
 

rIKmAN

Member
YYG can make it all complaints go away by simply naming it GMS 3, which would have required a paid upgrade if they hadn't switched to subscription. Then everyone will be happy. :)
The mental gymnastics people are doing (mainly on reddit, not here) to claim they are being swindled out of "perpetual updates for 2.x" and having things "locked/gated behind a paywall" is actually hurting my brain and I've had to stop reading it.

They'd rather suggest class action lawsuits for violating their rights than consider that the free subs offered to permanent licence holders will actually give them access to the full version of GMS probably into 3.x which their permanent licence wouldn't allow, as well as claiming that they wish YYG would have just rebranded to 3.x and then pretending that doing that wouldn't have caused the same or a worse uproar if it had happened and everyone had to pay the sub with no free sub conversion offer.

I really don't understand the mindset - just claim your free 12mths Indie for each permanent licence you own and you have access to the very features you are complaining about being gated behind a paywall - for free - because you are a permanent licence holder and with maybe 10 clicks of your mouse in less than a minute.

By the time that free sub expires the version will probably be 3.x anyway and you wouldn't be entitled to access it via your one time permanent licence that you payed $99 for however many years ago - so you are actually getting more than you were entitled to when you paid the licence.

I honestly can't think of a better, smoother or more generous way they could have handled the transition to the fully sub model while still respecting the people who bought permanent licences and going through the transition from 2x to 3.x while the permanent licences get phased out and locked to the final version of 2.x whenever that is.

I don't know what people want?
 
S

Sam (Deleted User)

Guest
So you aren't going to address the actual reason I answered?!?! As I said, license mixing on teams is generally prohibitied. See the EULA.... That said, it specifically refers to exports, not these paywalled features....but don't be surprised if something changes at some point in the future. And even if they don't change it, it still says you can't export other people's content which technically could include these paywalled features.
That means you can't compile open source games. Which they can't even begin to enforce, whether complete games, demos or examples. I'm weirded out to think how they managed to put that in their EULA without breaking some kind of international laws and agreements regarding open source software. That's like the equivalent of saying you cant share any source code at any level, because the whole point in doing so involves someone compiling it either way. Just think about all the open source tutorials and learning material they could revoke licenses over.... yikes.
 
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Cameron

Member
no, i mean, what i quoted from you, but that's your opinion, cool, i got one too
You are entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts. A subscription is not a debt. You do not owe yoyo any money, the renewal is a convenience feature so you don't have to keep making a purchase every month. You can unsubscribe at any time. You do not have to sign any contracts with yoyo, they do not have to check and see if you have a line of credit, you will not have any collectors calling you and asking for money. If you don't understand the nuances of these differences then that is on you.
 

kburkhart84

Firehammer Games
That means you can't compile open source games. Which they can't even begin to enforce.
I don't really see any way to enforce the actual intention of the quoted part of the EULA either honestly :) I'm not condoning piracy, but I don't see how they would be able to find out if some team members had subs/perpetual licenses and some didn't in any fashion.

I only re-iterated what I said because the person took the specific statement that was "un-official" and responded to only that in a bit of a snarky way completely saying "they aren't looking for speculation" without responding to the rest of the post at all. Without the rest of the context, it makes it look like I'm trying to just butt in and speculate when my main point was actually something else completely. And note that despite just now posting something else, they still haven't responded to my thoughts. Oh well. I'm not the EULA police or anything :) It was just a thought I had. They responded, albeit separately.
 

gnysek

Member
If you have no funds on debit card, subscription will finish, so also I don't see where debt could be made in this model. Dept is only when you didn't have money, and get negative balance on something. Recurring payment isn't negative balance or debt, it's recurring payment - you either pays, or your service ends. It's closer to renting IMHO.
 

jonjons

Member
I'll pretend you don't actually believe that.
I believe its easier to make a new one... than spending hours and hours if not months reading stuff other people made
[edit] you questioned well why not trying new things... well the problem is time, more time wasted on learning new game engines.
 
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Moth27

Member
Filter/Effects button no work.
where go what do? haha

I'm pretty sure the new filter presets are gonna end up being another feature that "seasoned" programmers will make video tutorials telling you NOT to use them because you can't control whats going on "under the hood."
 

gnysek

Member
"seasoned"
Good that you added quotes around that, as having source code of those shaders (hidden in runtime folder, but still not encrypted in any way), and knowing that they cannot be applied to selected layers, but to everything already drawn on screen (so no surfaces is created), this time with no doubt we know what happens under the hood, and there's no rocket since in it for average experienced user.
 

kburkhart84

Firehammer Games
Sometimes I just can't help myself.
No harm no foul. I was actually typing a thing out in response and decided to just leave it by so there is that.

This will work fine, the only things that will happen is that the filter/effect won't show up for them when they run the game and that they won't be able to edit any of the settings or add new filters to the project. The feature was designed with this exact situation in mind and it should not affect development
So does this mean that mixing licenses is going to be fine as far as using sub-only features in team projects?! I've seen confirmation that mixing licenses as far as for export purposes is certainly under the EULA 3.7 umbrella as being prohibited. If the same does not apply to these upcoming subscription paywall features, it would be a good idea to update the EULA accordingly.
 

Moth27

Member
Good that you added quotes around that, as having source code of those shaders (hidden in runtime folder, but still not encrypted in any way), and knowing that they cannot be applied to selected layers, but to everything already drawn on screen (so no surfaces is created), this time with no doubt we know what happens under the hood, and there's no rocket since in it for average experienced user.
are you saying they can be accessed and used without a sub?
 

rIKmAN

Member
No harm no foul. I was actually typing a thing out in response and decided to just leave it by so there is that.
You mean Tsuka cleaned the thread before you'd finished typing and had time to hit Enter? Been there...😄
are you saying they can be accessed and used without a sub?
The code for the effect (ie. the shader code) is accessible within the runtime folders, but you'd still need to apply it yourself and provide values via uniform to get anything working, so if you don't understand shaders then it's not going to be as simple as using the IDE to apply it to layers with the new feature.
Yeah why is the effects layer button grayed out?
Are you using an Indie subscription?
 

gnysek

Member
Yeah why is the effects layer button grayed out?
It's written in first post in this topic, and on blog post too, in release notes, and in newsletter (if you signed), and other half of this topic is also about that (even after half of posts were deleted by being too much offtop) :p

However, adding that yellow-cream fancy tooltip with proper info in IDE would be more than welcome, dear dev team.
 

Zhanghua

Member
You can chose not to get into debt in the first place, anyways, it's a different kind of debt, but it's debt, nontheless, every month, money goes out of your bank account, and you own nothing.
Guess how we feel about that, after buying the license to own the rights to use the software?
Yes. I found it, too.
How to cancel the subscription?
Destroy my yoyo account?
 

Moth27

Member
Isn't this feature kind of a DND one? Seems to be more geared to gaining new subs as opposed to impressing legacy users. As long as they don't grey out that Build/Export button I'm okay for now lol
 

rIKmAN

Member
Tkank you for the way.
So. Yoyo should have more service supplement.
Do you have free months left of your permanent licence conversion?
Maybe you can't "cancel" it on the site until it becomes an actual "paid" sub - just guessing though so best to contact support and see what they say.

edit:
The link gnysek posted tell you to contact them here: https://accounts.yoyogames.com/contact-us to do anything other than change your sub tier.
 

Zhanghua

Member
Do you have free months left of your permanent licence conversion?
Maybe you can't "cancel" it until it on the site until it becomes an actual "paid" sub - just guessing though so best to contact support and see what they say.
Yes. until 51 month...
I am afraid of the credit card out of the dae.
 

rIKmAN

Member
Yes. until 51 month...
I am afraid of the credit card out of the dae.
It shouldn't be charged until the free months run out, so you can just use the "Add payment method" button on the website to add your new one and remove the expired one when the time comes around.

I'm in the same boat with 51mths left and my card will also expire before that so I'll have to do the same.
 

gnysek

Member
That's interesting in fact, as subscription services loves to send emails when card is close to expiry date. I hope that our "free" months won't be cancelled if we don't enter new card details before old one expiries!
 

rIKmAN

Member
That's interesting in fact, as subscription services loves to send emails when card is close to expiry date. I hope that our "free" months won't be cancelled if we don't enter new card details before old one expiries!
I read it's all handled externally (by Stripe?) so I'm sure they have processes in place for dealing with expired cards as it's literally what they do.
Also I'd expect YYG support would be available to check and re-instate your free months if anything did go wrong along the way.
 
The mental gymnastics people are doing (mainly on reddit, not here) to claim they are being swindled out of "perpetual updates for 2.x" and having things "locked/gated behind a paywall" is actually hurting my brain and I've had to stop reading it.

They'd rather suggest class action lawsuits for violating their rights than consider that the free subs offered to permanent licence holders will actually give them access to the full version of GMS probably into 3.x which their permanent licence wouldn't allow, as well as claiming that they wish YYG would have just rebranded to 3.x and then pretending that doing that wouldn't have caused the same or a worse uproar if it had happened and everyone had to pay the sub with no free sub conversion offer.

I really don't understand the mindset - just claim your free 12mths Indie for each permanent licence you own and you have access to the very features you are complaining about being gated behind a paywall - for free - because you are a permanent licence holder and with maybe 10 clicks of your mouse in less than a minute.

By the time that free sub expires the version will probably be 3.x anyway and you wouldn't be entitled to access it via your one time permanent licence that you payed $99 for however many years ago - so you are actually getting more than you were entitled to when you paid the licence.

I honestly can't think of a better, smoother or more generous way they could have handled the transition to the fully sub model while still respecting the people who bought permanent licences and going through the transition from 2x to 3.x while the permanent licences get phased out and locked to the final version of 2.x whenever that is.

I don't know what people want?
I've been trying to stay out of this here, but I want to respond to this. I think the class-action stuff is over the top and this doesn't rustle my jimmies to that extent, but there is a cool breeze swaying my jimmies back and forth.

2.x features requiring a subscription haven't been mentioned before. I don't care about the overall subscription argument at all, Opera has clearly made up their minds and I have my views on it that won't help or hinder that fact. However, the fact is that when my free sub runs out, whenever that is, if I try to use 2.x after that, I will be returning to a gimped version of 2.x compared to what I was using when I had free sub, despite the fact I have a perpetual 2.x license. 3.0 has nothing to do with that.

I was under the impression that the perpetual 2.x license gave me access to all the upgrades and bug fixes for 2.x. Clearly, I'm wrong, but they should've been much more clear from the point they introduced subs about that. Almost everyone was saying "Ah, ok, nothing changes about my perpetual license because of this sub-model" here on the forums, multiple times. In fact, things did change. The license which was bought under the assumption that it would grant access to all the features of GMS 2.x has changed to not do that. They should've been going "Wait a minute folks, what you're saying isn't necessarily true, your perpetual license will only give you access to some of the new features." in the sub thread seeing as that is the case. I think I know why they didn't say that, but whatever.

If the sub-model hadn't been introduced, then I can't imagine a scenario where they would randomly introduce some features for 2.x but only if users paid extra on top of their pre-existing perpetual 2.x license. Once the free months of sub runs out, that's exactly what is going to be happening.
 

gnysek

Member
"Ah, ok, nothing changes about my perpetual license because of this sub-model"
And before subscriptions were introduced, for questions that something will change, they were always answering "we have nothing to announce at this time". From what I've learned in life, if any company uses we have nothing to announce at this time, something is cooking already, but it's too early to share.
 

rIKmAN

Member
this doesn't rustle my jimmies to that extent, but there is a cool breeze swaying my jimmies back and forth.
I'd suggest some tighter fitting jimmies if a cool breeze has them swaying....or keep the jimmies and do some squats - your call! :)

Seriously though - I can see where you are coming from but I'm not ready to jump on that bandwagon just yet.

They could have easily labelled any of the recent updates GMS v3.x (especially the big change from 2.2.5 > 2.3) and shafted every permanent licence holder by offering no upgrades and moving to sub only from here on out but they didn't. They offered a 12mth Indie sub for free per licence which was way more generous than I expected.

Would it have been a wise move - no - but they could have and we'd have no leg to stand on with regards to permanent licences giving access to anything other than what we already had. This alone means they've earned my benefit of the doubt to see where they go with it.

I would expect that the final version of 2.x for permanent licence holders will contain all features that were released in any 2.x version - whether it was initially limited to users who were subbed or not - and that the permanent licence holder can use that final 2.x version in perpetuity with that existing licence - much the same way people still use GM8 even now using licences bought god knows how many years ago.

If that turns out to not be the case then my view would probably change as like you said, the permanent licence was sold for "updates during lifetime of 2.x" or very similar wording which the general person would take to mean "any and all updates to the IDE/Runtime that are labelled as a 2.x version".

The new features are just that - brand new - and it's already been said that they will be available to others later so I'm reading that as what I said above and that they will become a part of 2.x for everyone at some point in the future.
"Major features" being locked to "sub only" could also mean v3.x features which would be locked for permanent licence holders anyway so wouldn't be applicable and there isn't any argument to be had there.

Lastly, offering these to subs only at the start I see as a small reward to people that are actually paying subs currently (not free conversions like myself) and feeding development with sub income, with the bonus that permanent licence holders can get the free conversion and also get access to them. This is why I can't get my head around people claiming things are gated when they clearly aren't at this current moment in time.

Sure you have to claim your free sub time but is a few clicks of the mouse and a couple of minutes of your time really that much of a hassle when you are getting between 1-4yrs of Indie subscription for no extra cost than what you already paid? That seems like a bargain to me!

Speculating about what may or may not happen in the future is largely pointless, but I think YYG have earned enough trust over time with the way they have handled the ongoing transition from permanent to sub and from 2.x to 3.x (for me at least) for me not to jump to the worst possible conclusion before anything has even happened - such as claiming they are locking me out of any features I should be entitled to when I have full access to them for 51mths - for free!

If the final version of GMS2 doesn't include all the features that were added and released in a Stable 2.x version then my view would change as I said, but we can't predict the future and YYG have always tried to do good by the community for the most part and given the circumstances, so let's give them a chance to do the same again before jumping all over them and making silly claims (not you, reddit again...).
 

rIKmAN

Member
If that turns out to be the case, then I have no issue with what is going on.
Given the last update to 1.4.9999 they did that they didn't have to but did, and the way they have treated permanent licence holders with regards to the amount of free Indie sub they get for each licence then I'll remain optimistic that this is what will happen until it doesn't.

I might be wrong but the wording certainly comes across like that to me anyway, so fingers crossed!
 
So, it looks like the permanent licence will become another feature limited licence - free licence-plus plus, in oreder to pormote the permanent licence user to make a choice :
- 1) Accpet this even after their generous free month is end.
- 2) Become a subscriber.
- 3) Leave.

And there are still many unclear description to give it endless possibilities.
”Access to GameMaker Studio 2 is free for all, but in order for this to work, some major features will only be available to subscribers. Other features will be available for all, but will be released to subscribers first for early access ”
- 1) Except the "Filters and Effects" feature in 2.3.6 ( it seems just an "Other feature), which features would be the "Major Freature", and which features wolud be the "Other Feature" in future ? It's not clear here.
- 2) There is no answer for how long this "Other freature 's EA phase" will last. A week , a month, a quarter, a year , event longer ?
- 3) Will it update some new "Major Feature" in the future ? And the permanent licence user would not be allowed to use the "Major Freature" ?

Above that, i doubt if more limitation to permanent licence would gradually beacome, and they are testing people's reaction to this.
 
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Mightyjor

Member
While I admit I don’t care much about the shaders, I’m worried about what features will be locked out in the future. This seems to be a move that has destroyed a lot of the goodwill Opera has built up recently. I’ll still use GMS2 because I love it, but I can’t see myself sticking around for much longer if my pre-subscription license is for an engine that eventually becomes unsupported.
 

Cameron

Member
Yeah so I upgraded. Still think it's a scumbag move. And it's still grayed out.
You have to log out of the IDE and then log back in again and you will have it. I had to do the same thing.

Edit: You have to click on the file button on the top left of the IDE and you will see the log out option near the bottom of the drop down.
 

Coded Games

Member
Well I saw this update and was 100% hyped to add a blur effect I've wanted for a while. Then saw it wasn't available to license owners and was at -10% hype. Yoyo, you are doing so much good lately and it's awesome but please stop the rollercoaster of emotions I get with each news post. I think it mostly hurts due to the relative insignificance of this updating being locked behind a paywall. Ultimately Filters and Effects has already existed, they're called Shaders. But now if you want to use them in a more user friendly way you have to pay for it.

And ultimately I'm not against features being locked behind a paywall if they were more significant. Like new platforms, entirely new tools, SVG sprites (please), integration with other GameDev tools like Wwise, etc.
 
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