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Discussion Export Modules with Pro version of 1.x

I tried to find out where the information was but I only found the different GMS2 versions. The question here is:

I have export modules: HTML5,Android,iOS and UWP

Will these export options still be available in the desktop version of the software after buying it at 60$ discounted price? OR will I loose the ability to export in HTML5, Android and iOS after my passing to GMS2?
 

Tthecreator

Your Creator!
You will have to buy those separately for gms2.
Right now you can only buy the desktop for windows, linux and mac.
 

MilesThatch

Member
What about integration of Steam API, or is it too early to be releasing games with GMS2? (considering it's labeled as beta)

PS: there's a release schedule plan on the yoyo blog, I think
 
I'm not asking if the export modules will be compatible with v2. I'm just asking if I will need to REbuy AGAIN those export modules for V2 which I would find pretty annoying knowing I paid for the previous ones.
 

rIKmAN

Member
I'm not asking if the export modules will be compatible with v2. I'm just asking if I will need to REbuy AGAIN those export modules for V2 which I would find pretty annoying knowing I paid for the previous ones.
Yes, the export modules for 1.x and 2.x are separate, so the modules you own for 1.x will only work for that version, and any modules you want for 2.x will need to be repurchased.
 
For 60$, I can only export on Windows and loose all my other export modules. That's an enormous put down to buy V2, I was thinking to buy it this week. Now, it's lost. GMS2 for me is just not worth it for 60$ US, I loose too much.
 

rIKmAN

Member
For 60$, I can only export on Windows and loose all my other export modules. That's an enormous put down to buy V2, I was thinking to buy it this week. Now, it's lost. GMS2 for me is just not worth it for 60$ US, I loose too much.
You don't lose the ability to continue using GMS1 and all the export modules because you buy GMS2, you will have access to both.

You will still be able to use / export to all your owned targets for 1.x, and will be able to export to Desktop on GMS2 + any other GMS2 exports you buy when they are released in the future.
 
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csanyk

Member
I'm not asking if the export modules will be compatible with v2. I'm just asking if I will need to REbuy AGAIN those export modules for V2 which I would find pretty annoying knowing I paid for the previous ones.
You have to pay to upgrade, for each module. Just as you had to pay for Professional, HTML5, etc. If you want to consider that re-buying them, then ok, yes you would need to buy everything again. It's at least discounted.

For 60$, I can only export on Windows and loose all my other export modules. That's an enormous put down to buy V2, I was thinking to buy it this week. Now, it's lost. GMS2 for me is just not worth it for 60$ US, I loose too much.
You don't lose anything; you still have your GMS1.x licenses for whatever modules you owned, and you can still use those. Buying 2.0, you gain 2.0. You don't lose anything.
 

Nocturne

Friendly Tyrant
Forum Staff
Admin
GameMaker Studio 2 is not an update to Studio 1.4. It is a completely new version and as such it has no relation to 1.4. You can still use 1.4 and it will still be maintained and receive essential bug fixes for the foreseeable future. Also note that your $60 doesn't just get you windows, it gets you Mac and Ubuntu (linux) exports too, and it also lifts all limits from the Trial version.
 
OK, but I program for HTML5 and Android mainly. Can't you people offer budles at the same price. For example, Windows Mac and Linux or Windows Android and HTML5 or Mac iOS and HTML or Windows Android ans Linux. You know, some sort of choose a 3 pack. That would be great and well worth the 60$ as, here is something. To export on Mac, you NEED a MAC so having the possibility to export on MAC, for me absolutely not worth a penny as I cannot test anything. As for linux, it's a free system, the idea of porting to ubuntu is good but most Windows users won't even have a VM installed with Linux or an actual computer.

I understand your license now but to me, everyone has internet and (debatable enough) most people have phones or tablettes SO exporting to HTML5 and Android or iOS would be much worth the 60$ and just for this license modification, I would be willing to buy it as I have an android phone and port in HTML5. So Windows, HTML5 and ANdroid would be good for me but not for everyone which is why I would give the freedom to choose a 3 pack for 60$ where we choose and of course, add extras if we want more.
 

csanyk

Member
OK, but I program for HTML5 and Android mainly. Can't you people offer budles at the same price. For example, Windows Mac and Linux or Windows Android and HTML5 or Mac iOS and HTML or Windows Android ans Linux. You know, some sort of choose a 3 pack. That would be great and well worth the 60$ as, here is something. To export on Mac, you NEED a MAC so having the possibility to export on MAC, for me absolutely not worth a penny as I cannot test anything. As for linux, it's a free system, the idea of porting to ubuntu is good but most Windows users won't even have a VM installed with Linux or an actual computer.

I understand your license now but to me, everyone has internet and (debatable enough) most people have phones or tablettes SO exporting to HTML5 and Android or iOS would be much worth the 60$ and just for this license modification, I would be willing to buy it as I have an android phone and port in HTML5. So Windows, HTML5 and ANdroid would be good for me but not for everyone which is why I would give the freedom to choose a 3 pack for 60$ where we choose and of course, add extras if we want more.
I will agree with you in that I wish the HTML5 module cost the same as the Desktop module. I can understand certain modules costing more, depending on how much they cost to develop and support, as well as the value proposition for the developer (eg, a professional developer buying the Console module stands to make a lot of money from Microsoft/Sony/Nintendo, say, so arguably they should pay more for it than they do for the Desktop module or the Mobile module.)

That said, from the value proposition standpoint, it probably is easiest to make money from the HTML5 and Mobile builds. HTML5 games are easy to embed in a web page surrounded by ads, and mobile apps are sold through stores and plugged into app stores, so lots of built in monetization. It's harder to make money from desktop apps, less is built in and done for you. So I can well understand why they feel they're worth more money. They may also be more expensive to develop the product and support it -- hard for me to say, but just speculating, HTML5 is a pretty messy platform, supporting different versions of various browsers is a lot of work.
 
Anyone can understand marketing BUT if 100 people or more (whatever number you put here) decide to say the price system is not good, that can make YYG decide for a change in their price system. I'm just saying that if people keep trying to please YYG with their answers for prices, that won't help bringing the price down or change the licensing system. All there needs is a bunch of people that agree to choose a 3 pack system instead of a platform system. You know...if people join to pass a message, YYG will understand but if a post like this one just says: "Well you know, we understand the whole thing and it's understandable. Yeah, we're not 100% pleased but we'll live with it..." THAT will NEVER make YYG change a thing for their system.

We have the chance to tell YYG that we'd prefer more freedom in the choice of which exports we want AND better prices. More poeple that like this and want this, the better the message will go through and the more chances we'll get someone at YYG to think of changes in their pricing and export modules.
 

csanyk

Member
The thing is, though, that I've thought about the matter, and my conclusion is that I prefer YYG to price the modules that are of more interest to professionals higher, and use that to subsidize lower prices for the casual/hobby/educational developer.

Obviously, anyone is going to want lower prices. YYG can only do so much there. At some point, if the market refuses to support the product at a price point that sustains the company, the company goes out of business. Demanding lower prices is unreasonable if it ignores this reality.

I do think that the idea of an a la carte bundle has appeal for the purchaser. I'd love a Windows + HTML5 only bundle for say $75, as I don't have a build environment for OS X. But with upgrade pricing, I'm going to end up with Desktop and HTML5 for $125, and have the option to build for Linux and OS X if I ever want to. Plus I know that I'm helping YYG to stay in business, and hopefully further advance the product so I can do more with it.

I expect they'll have sales in the future, as well, but for most users the value of having it now outweighs the savings of waiting for a sale.
 
N

NPT

Guest
The only problem I have with the new bundling is the Mobile forced bundle.

There's likely a few who want iOS but not Android, or Android and not iOS. Not being able to buy them separately forces people to pay more than they should have to for something they will never need.
 

csanyk

Member
The only problem I have with the new bundling is the Mobile forced bundle.

There's likely a few who want iOS but not Android, or Android and not iOS. Not being able to buy them separately forces people to pay more than they should have to for something they will never need.
Or you can think of it like buy one, get extras free whether you need them or not.

It's like a multitool, where you really only use 2 or 3 of the tools most of the time. But you still have the tools you never use.

I'm aware that to develop for iOS you have to pay Apple for the privilege of being a developer, but I believe that you can get the Android sdk for free, and just do native development, if you are only interested in one build target.
 

Llama_Code

Member
I'm not a fan of the forced mobile bundle either, as I don't own a single Apple device, and won't buy one, so it's useless. But I see where they are going.

As for the pick 3 idea, you have to realize that some modules hold a higher value than others, so that ideology wouldn't work. The Android module for example is worth more when you factor what money you could make with it (same for ios for that matter) . Where as the Desktop modules are the least valuable because they are the hardest to monetize. The more lucrative the market is, the more the modules will be worth, and that will play in to the price as well.
 
That's what was good in V1, you could buy those export modules separately. Other thing you can consider, the HTML5 module was worth a lot less than other export modules. But let's say that for a limited time and for already paid custumers with Android and HTML5 modules, they could be rewarded with a discount and have the 3 pack at 60$ for a limited time only. A kind of 24 hour only value pack. A choose 3 pack for 60$ for 24 hours only or even 12. Just so that people like us, that constantly wish for better GMS can get a hold of those modules for a good price. Just to not forget that the discount price would ONLY be for those that ALREADY have the export modules in V1. So if you baught pro only, then this option would not be available. But is you have iOS and HTML5 export modules for v1, then get that discounted price for a short time. That would be fair for those that baught the modules in V1.
 

csanyk

Member
I don't see why they couldn't offer additional bundles, with different combinations of modules, to suit different developer's needs.

For example, I could see an "Apple" bundle consisting of the OS X build target + iOS, for let's say $250. You could Run in Windows, for debugging, but not create a build for Windows with this bundle. That would appeal to devs who only want to target Apple platforms, and would enable them to get what they need for the equivalent cost of half of the $99 Desktop bundle + half of the $399 Mobile bundle.

I could also see a "Microsoft" bundle, which consists of the Windows build target, UWP, and Xbox. This could be priced at half of Desktop ($99) + UWP ($399) + half of Console (TBD). = $250+TBD.

Maybe a "Google" bundle that consists of HTML5 + Android + Chrome OS (which doesn't exist yet, but maybe one day...)

Of course then customers would complain about buying overlapping bundles and having to "pay twice" for stuff that's included in multiple bundles.

Ultimately, I guess the conclusion I'm arriving at is you could do an a la carte "My bundle" that consists of just what you want, at the proportionate fraction of the cost of the existing bundles, eg:

Windows = $33
Mac = $33
Ubuntu = $33
HTML5 = 150
UWP = $400
iOS = $200
Android = $200
PS4 = 0.5 * Console
Xbox = 0.5 * Console
etc.

The problem with this, and the reason YoYo likely won't do it, is that a very large number of users would pay $33 for Windows and not build on Mac or Ubuntu, leading to YYG eventually killing those off, which I think would be horrible -- Microsoft monopoly killing off competetion SUCKS. If $99 for Desktop subsidizes Mac and Ubuntu game dev that otherwise would be too small a market to serve, I'm very much in favor of that.

Likewise, perhaps the mobile bundle helps keep competition even between iOS and Android, and if so I'm very much in favor of that, again for free market reasons.

So maybe, then we could hope to persuade YYG to do something like this:

Desktop = $100
HTML5 = 150
UWP = $400
iOS = $200
Android = $200
PS4 = 0.5 * Console
Xbox = 0.5 * Console
etc.

That way, YYG get their $100 revenue they need to stay in business, customers can buy what modules they want/need at a cost proportionate to the bundle it came from, and maybe YYG gets a few more sales that way.

But probably there would need to be some slight price premium paid for going a la carte, say [proportional price] + $10-20 per module, such that it would keep the bundles attractive.

Whether it makes sense for them to do that is if they make more money selling individual build targets, or by selling bundles. I'll assume YYG did some marketing research to come up with their pricing and bundling structure, and it's idle speculation to second guess it.

It's far more likely that they'll do sale specials a few years from now rather than change everything up with their bundling. So... I guess if you're really tightfisted and on a budget, and can't buy everything, buy Desktop for now and eventually buy whatever else when it hits a sale price that you find acceptable.
 
Yep. I'll wait a few years to get a 75% off bundle and realise a few weeks later that V3 is on it's way and they will AGAIN boost their prices up to make others pay for already baught modules.

That's just nonsense. A big company like YYG that can pay itself programming teams and headquarters CAN, for a short period of time (i/e a few hours), permit a sale for those that have been YEARS with YYG and have exportation modules that WILL be lost in V2. Basically, a few hour sale to let us, the oldies, buy at rebate the export modules we need. I think 60$ is pretty good for Windows Android and HTML5 and to me, I'd buy it even though I hate the GUI and find it sucks for Windows users (not that V1 is better, they just transfered irritants someplace else). I'd buy it just to be up to date if I'd have the opportunity to have those modules without cashing over 80$ to REBUY what I already baught.

For now, I'm seeing my self being way behind everyone that have enough cash to buy big bundles where half of what they paid for won't be used IE MAC and LINUX export when you are a WINDOWS programmer and user only. YYG will have their needed revenu anyways and already have, I don't see why a special Christmas rebate for 12-24 hours only would bring such a problem. They will probably boost their sales up with thousands of people that way making more money than those waiting their paycheck and waiting to have enough cash after a few months to buy something they half need.

For example, let's just say I buy the desktop version at 60$. I still want the Android and HTML. BUY to have them I need to buy the whole bundle instead of just the export. AND again, 2 of these export, I will never use. So to me, I won't even use Game Maker to my whole ash value. I will have paid 60$ for a 20$ special as I only use 1/3 of the exports.
 

csanyk

Member
Yep. I'll wait a few years to get a 75% off bundle and realise a few weeks later that V3 is on it's way and they will AGAIN boost their prices up to make others pay for already baught modules.

That's just nonsense. A big company like YYG that can pay itself programming teams and headquarters CAN, for a short period of time (i/e a few hours), permit a sale for those that have been YEARS with YYG and have exportation modules that WILL be lost in V2. Basically, a few hour sale to let us, the oldies, buy at rebate the export modules we need. I think 60$ is pretty good for Windows Android and HTML5 and to me, I'd buy it even though I hate the GUI and find it sucks for Windows users (not that V1 is better, they just transfered irritants someplace else). I'd buy it just to be up to date if I'd have the opportunity to have those modules without cashing over 80$ to REBUY what I already baught.

For now, I'm seeing my self being way behind everyone that have enough cash to buy big bundles where half of what they paid for won't be used IE MAC and LINUX export when you are a WINDOWS programmer and user only. YYG will have their needed revenu anyways and already have, I don't see why a special Christmas rebate for 12-24 hours only would bring such a problem. They will probably boost their sales up with thousands of people that way making more money than those waiting their paycheck and waiting to have enough cash after a few months to buy something they half need.

For example, let's just say I buy the desktop version at 60$. I still want the Android and HTML. BUY to have them I need to buy the whole bundle instead of just the export. AND again, 2 of these export, I will never use. So to me, I won't even use Game Maker to my whole ash value. I will have paid 60$ for a 20$ special as I only use 1/3 of the exports.
Not to be rude, but this is a really lousy way to look at it.

It almost sounds to me like YYG could make you happy by charging $5000 for GMS2, but giving you a 90% off sale price so that you only pay $500.

Let's apply a la carte logic to "buying GML" (as if I could do that). I don't do 3D game development, ever. So to me, buying ALL of GML, with all those d3d functions, is a complete waste to me. I should be able to buy a stripped down GML for, like, half off, shouldn't I? And I also don't use paths, or tiles. I don't want to pay for those, either! Can't I just pay for the functions I use all the time? And I figure I can save some money by using paint.net to do my sprites instead of the built-in editor, do I get a discount for that?

I bought a house, but I hardly ever spend time anywhere but the kitchen, bathroom, and bedroom. Why did I have to pay for the living room, basement, extra bedrooms, none of which I need?

Why don't you look at it like it costs $400 for Android, but it comes with iOS as a BONUS for FREE! (and vice versa for iOS devs who don't do Android for whatever reason). If you don't use it, no loss. Why are you looking at it like each costs $200, when there IS no option for buying them individually?

You get what you get; it's up to you to use it or not.

You're entitled to decide for yourself how much it's worth to you to buy whatever modules, but whatever you buy, it's a very good bet that you're going to use a percentage of it, and not use certain parts of it, ever.

I don't know what your economic situation is, maybe you live somewhere with a terrible economy, or maybe you're retired on a fixed income, or a broke student buried in debt. If so, well I'm sorry. But if you're buying the big money modules, the assumption is that you're in business making games, and will be making that money back when you sell what you build with the tool. Or at the very least, taking a tax deduction on your capital expenditures. It takes money to make money. But let's face it, making money in game development isn't easy. If you're not making money with your Android builds, well, maybe consider yourself a hobbyist and do cheaper development. Why does YoYo OWE you a product at a price YOU demand?

It isn't like there aren't other tools out there that are free; invest yourself in learning to use them. vi + gcc are excellent, free, and if you master them, you'll be able to command a six figure salary within a few years.
 

Llama_Code

Member
I think the key think that people fail to realize is that YoYo is not targeting the hobby sector anymore. Certainly hobbyists to buy it and use it, but it's not their main focus.

IMHO the price is GMS is fine even for a hobby because there are a lot of much more expensive hobbies out there with no real ROI, however GMS can give you that is you want.

But at the end of the day they are a business, and they have to make money to. They are already giving current owners a 40-50% discount I think thats pretty damn generous. I have been using GM since version 4, and I have no qualms buying again knowing that money will go to future and better versions of GM.
 

Chaser

Member
I think Yoyo have been reasonable with there discounts and prices at the moment, and it's clear that it's not easy to juggle prices to suit every developer out there, let's not forget that with GMS before a the realease GM2 is still very much a powerful tool, even if you choose to not to upgrade to GM2 right now you will ok to programme for a couple of years yet. The html 5 hasn't been released yet and I no doubt Yoyo will offer a discount on that, and I find that everything so far you do in the GMS desktop version works fine when changing the export the html 5, I expect the same with GM2 so the desktop module is not a waste of money for $60, so you can still develop for html5 (and maybe android,I don't know) with GM2 desktop version, then maybe wait until the sales to pick up the other exports you need.;)
 
Well, it's hard to see that people don't want to try and get cheaper pries. I'm actually surprised to see that many people don't take the time to think that a company an rethink their prie list. As for the weird example that came out here is a small basic overview of GM with the years:

GM4 - Free
GM5 - Pro license to use alpha blending and other graphial functions (25$)
GM6 - Pretty much the same as 5 with a little 3D touch that began (Free with GM5 already baught key)
GM7 - Pretty much the same as 5 but with better 3D funtions (Free if already with GM6)
GM8 - Same as 5 with the 3D functions lots of people know already (Paid with a very good discounted price 25$)
GMS - Pro license and extra money for additionnal modules (50$ Paid with a very good discount price AND possible to pay for additionnal exports)
GMS2 - Desktop, no more pro and you have to rebuy all of what you had before

As you can see the evolution was, get new stuff, pay for new stuff. Now YYG does not offer new stuff but a new interface with lots of improvements in creation mode (I'm basic here, no details).

So let's see, the whole pay process and weirdness started when GM was sold to YYG which, you will remember was some people that initially worked with XBOX, hence the new green logo (that's just my opinion, it's a small inside). Once the whole machine of GM got transfered to someone whelmed in the Microsoft industry, you start having the same Microsoft thinking. Hey we are making a new version, let's get people to pay all over again for this one, like going from Windows 95 to 98 to 2k to XP to Vista. MS got tired of supporting the older software and found out that giving people that initially had recent version an upgrade at a very low price, they got to have their customers upgrade their system. That gives less work to MS as with Windows 7,8 or 8.1 to Windows 10 which was totally free. Microsoft changed their way of thinking, well for Windows. Now they got into that infamouse payed subscription hell where softwares last for the time you pay. I just hope YYG won't fall into that in a few years (which I doubt as that would not be clear to me).

What I'm saying is that, a person that stayed on GM8 get's to pay for a desktop version of GMS2 at a rebate price of 60$ is good and fair enough. BUT I, who has paid for the html5 and android version, I have to pay again full price for those SAME functions??? It's just not logical. What happens to those that paid for Master collection? That was a hefty price for GMS, over 500$ if you were lucky and nearing the 900$ on the bad days. They need to shell out another 500$ or more to keep things up??? It's just not logical. That's a heck of a lot of money.

If GMS2 is to be paid at such high prices because it's way out of what GMS was and not the same products, then, call Ultimate Game Creation Studio from YYG and NOT GameMaker Studio 2. I would have understood that much better. But it's GMS2, Not UGCS. I think that shelling out another 60$ to keep me updated and with the same things I paid earlier before is not to much asked and I'm not exagerating.

Again, I can't believe that people try to please YYG with their answers by saying that they are OK with the prices they set for existing long term customers over 50$ AGAIN. It seems that people just LOVE shelling out money just at one place. Would anyone want to pay 60$ for GMS2 for 3 of their existing, already paid, export modules from GMS1? Would that please anyone?

I'm not asking to pay less than whats presented on the web, I'm just wandering if I'm the only one that thinks he threw his money away on GMS1 when all of what I accumulated so far will get unsupported in a few months as I understood that GMS1 will have no other new stuff which means it just stopped following technology as of GMS2 Beta's release.
 

Llama_Code

Member
As you can see the evolution was, get new stuff, pay for new stuff. Now YYG does not offer new stuff but a new interface with lots of improvements in creation mode (I'm basic here, no details).
GMS 2 is a complete rewrite of the program from the ground up with tons of new features. I don't see how you say it offers nothing new. Plus, your comparing GM from when Mark made it as a hobby in his spare time, to GM being made and sold by a legitimate business that must make money to stay in business.

Also, GM foray in to paying started by donation only, but so few people donated Mark was forced to introduce the paid model. Most likely from people like you that think everything should be handed to them. I actually donated $100 to Mark for GM 5.

GMS 1.4 will continue to be updated with bug fixes and to maintain platform compatibility, it just will not be getting new features.

I have made thousands of dollars with GMs 1.4. No, I don't think I threw my money away in buying it. If you do, maybe you should evaluate why you want it and if you need it.

Software progresses, few programs are supported forever.

I think you just need to accept the pricing structure is not for you and move on. It's priced for serious developers, and given the money you can make is quite cheap. I would pay twice what they are asking, because I know I will make it back over and over again.
 

xDGameStudios

GameMaker Staff
GameMaker Dev.
Well, it's hard to see that people don't want to try and get cheaper pries. I'm actually surprised to see that many people don't take the time to think that a company an rethink their prie list. As for the weird example that came out here is a small basic overview of GM with the years:

GM4 - Free
GM5 - Pro license to use alpha blending and other graphial functions (25$)
GM6 - Pretty much the same as 5 with a little 3D touch that began (Free with GM5 already baught key)
GM7 - Pretty much the same as 5 but with better 3D funtions (Free if already with GM6)
GM8 - Same as 5 with the 3D functions lots of people know already (Paid with a very good discounted price 25$)
GMS - Pro license and extra money for additionnal modules (50$ Paid with a very good discount price AND possible to pay for additionnal exports)
GMS2 - Desktop, no more pro and you have to rebuy all of what you had before

As you can see the evolution was, get new stuff, pay for new stuff. Now YYG does not offer new stuff but a new interface with lots of improvements in creation mode (I'm basic here, no details).

So let's see, the whole pay process and weirdness started when GM was sold to YYG which, you will remember was some people that initially worked with XBOX, hence the new green logo (that's just my opinion, it's a small inside). Once the whole machine of GM got transfered to someone whelmed in the Microsoft industry, you start having the same Microsoft thinking. Hey we are making a new version, let's get people to pay all over again for this one, like going from Windows 95 to 98 to 2k to XP to Vista. MS got tired of supporting the older software and found out that giving people that initially had recent version an upgrade at a very low price, they got to have their customers upgrade their system. That gives less work to MS as with Windows 7,8 or 8.1 to Windows 10 which was totally free. Microsoft changed their way of thinking, well for Windows. Now they got into that infamouse payed subscription hell where softwares last for the time you pay. I just hope YYG won't fall into that in a few years (which I doubt as that would not be clear to me).

What I'm saying is that, a person that stayed on GM8 get's to pay for a desktop version of GMS2 at a rebate price of 60$ is good and fair enough. BUT I, who has paid for the html5 and android version, I have to pay again full price for those SAME functions??? It's just not logical. What happens to those that paid for Master collection? That was a hefty price for GMS, over 500$ if you were lucky and nearing the 900$ on the bad days. They need to shell out another 500$ or more to keep things up??? It's just not logical. That's a heck of a lot of money.

If GMS2 is to be paid at such high prices because it's way out of what GMS was and not the same products, then, call Ultimate Game Creation Studio from YYG and NOT GameMaker Studio 2. I would have understood that much better. But it's GMS2, Not UGCS. I think that shelling out another 60$ to keep me updated and with the same things I paid earlier before is not to much asked and I'm not exagerating.

Again, I can't believe that people try to please YYG with their answers by saying that they are OK with the prices they set for existing long term customers over 50$ AGAIN. It seems that people just LOVE shelling out money just at one place. Would anyone want to pay 60$ for GMS2 for 3 of their existing, already paid, export modules from GMS1? Would that please anyone?

I'm not asking to pay less than whats presented on the web, I'm just wandering if I'm the only one that thinks he threw his money away on GMS1 when all of what I accumulated so far will get unsupported in a few months as I understood that GMS1 will have no other new stuff which means it just stopped following technology as of GMS2 Beta's release.
I don't want to sound rude... but ... if, like you said, "YYG does not offer new stuff" with its new software GMS2.. and its improvements are not worth the price... then I think you should not feel the need to buy it. I bet you would think that if everybody "joined forces" to ask YYG to sell GameMaker Studio 2 for 5$ it would be great!! It would and I don't believe any of the buyers would think twice xD ....but.... well... that is not how business works. Liked the 3 export pack ideia, though ;)
 
T

TheProgrammer163

Guest
GMS 2 is a complete rewrite of the program from the ground up with tons of new features. I don't see how you say it offers nothing new. Plus, your comparing GM from when Mark made it as a hobby in his spare time, to GM being made and sold by a legitimate business that must make money to stay in business.

Also, GM foray in to paying started by donation only, but so few people donated Mark was forced to introduce the paid model. Most likely from people like you that think everything should be handed to them. I actually donated $100 to Mark for GM 5.

GMS 1.4 will continue to be updated with bug fixes and to maintain platform compatibility, it just will not be getting new features.

I have made thousands of dollars with GMs 1.4. No, I don't think I threw my money away in buying it. If you do, maybe you should evaluate why you want it and if you need it.

Software progresses, few programs are supported forever.

I think you just need to accept the pricing structure is not for you and move on. It's priced for serious developers, and given the money you can make is quite cheap. I would pay twice what they are asking, because I know I will make it back over and over again.
I agree with everything you said. Plus we don't have to upgrade, I bought the beta for desktop already, I plan on sticking to GameMaker: Studio for Android and HTML. At least for now.

Side question - where does most of your revenue come from, Android/iOS, HTML, desktop?
 
GMS2 is worth way more than 5$, don't get me wrong here. All I'm saying is that I need to pay twice for what I already purchased. I need to REPAY for HTML5 and REPAY for Android. I don't want people yelling to ask and drop prices. I'm just saying that what I paid for in GMS should at least stay in GMS2 as a 3 pack option. Nothing more. I'm willing to shell out a few bucks for GMS2 but not loose my Android and HTML5 exports, that's just not right as I paid for those already and with their present offered packs, I'd need to spend over 150$ just to get those 2 back. Just to let you know that the previous ones were between 50$ and 200$ each for both export modulesa and I need to shell out AGAIN those amounts? That's my point, I just want what I paid back in version 2 paying of cours an upgrade fee for the new rewritten version. I'm not interested in MAC, linux, iOS, PS, XBOX or others, just plaine Windows, Android and HTML5 as I already have.
 

csanyk

Member
I'm actually surprised to see that many people don't take the time to think that a company an rethink their prie list. As for the weird example that came out here is a small basic overview of GM with the years:

GM4 - Free
GM5 - Pro license to use alpha blending and other graphial functions (25$)
GM6 - Pretty much the same as 5 with a little 3D touch that began (Free with GM5 already baught key)
GM7 - Pretty much the same as 5 but with better 3D funtions (Free if already with GM6)
GM8 - Same as 5 with the 3D functions lots of people know already (Paid with a very good discounted price 25$)
GMS - Pro license and extra money for additionnal modules (50$ Paid with a very good discount price AND possible to pay for additionnal exports)
GMS2 - Desktop, no more pro and you have to rebuy all of what you had before
GM was dirt cheap until 8 because it was being developed by a sole proprietorship. When YYG bought out Mark Overmars, it became the property of a company with multiple employees, and they have improved it by leaps and bounds, adding new features much more quickly than Overmars could. Being a real company, they need a lot more revenue in order to operate.

Nevertheless, people HOWLED when YYG raised the price from $25 to $40. Oh, how they howled! They had to save their birthday money and allowance for almost TWICE as long as before! YoYo was evil and greedy!

Look, GMS2 is INFINITELY more expensive than the FREE 4. Obviously, the value proposition of 4 is infinite, and GMS2 is never going to be anywhere near that, even if they charge a penny for it.

As you can see the evolution was, get new stuff, pay for new stuff. Now YYG does not offer new stuff but a new interface with lots of improvements in creation mode (I'm basic here, no details).
If you don't think it's worth it to buy, stay on GMS1.

Once the whole machine of GM got transfered to someone whelmed in the Microsoft industry, you start having the same Microsoft thinking. Hey we are making a new version, let's get people to pay all over again for this one, like going from Windows 95 to 98 to 2k to XP to Vista.
You REALLY need to check out gnu.org and all the free stuff you can get there. vi + gcc. linux. apache. ALL FREE. SUPER POWERFUL. PRO QUALITY. LIMITLESS POTENTIAL.

I understand there's even FOSS game engines.

MS got tired of supporting the older software and found out that giving people that initially had recent version an upgrade at a very low price, they got to have their customers upgrade their system. That gives less work to MS as with Windows 7,8 or 8.1 to Windows 10 which was totally free. Microsoft changed their way of thinking, well for Windows. Now they got into that infamouse payed subscription hell where softwares last for the time you pay. I just hope YYG won't fall into that in a few years (which I doubt as that would not be clear to me).
Yeah, I hate the idea of software as a service, and paying for a subscription. That would have been a dealbreaker for me.

The reality is, businesses need to continuously produce revenue, and ideally they like to grow revenue over time.

What I'm saying is that, a person that stayed on GM8 get's to pay for a desktop version of GMS2 at a rebate price of 60$ is good and fair enough. BUT I, who has paid for the html5 and android version, I have to pay again full price for those SAME functions???
Wait, do you not realize that you're entitled to the 40-50% upgrade discount on these modules as well? When YoYo release the additional bundles for GMS2, you'll get upgrade pricing on them.

It's just not logical. What happens to those that paid for Master collection? That was a hefty price for GMS, over 500$ if you were lucky and nearing the 900$ on the bad days. They need to shell out another 500$ or more to keep things up??? It's just not logical. That's a heck of a lot of money.
Hi, I'm one of those people who paid for Master Collection, very early, and paid $500. At initial release, this wasn't an option. I paid:

  • For GM8.0. $25. Just shortly before 8.1 was released and they raised the price to $40. I could have paid nothing for 8.0, because that was an option, but I wanted to unlock all the features so I could try them out. I did this without worrying about it.
  • I got 8.1 for free. They gave me the 8.1 upgrade for no additional cost, as I was entitled to it as a 8.0 Pro user. THANK YOU YOYOGAMES.
  • For the GM:HTML5 beta. Yes, I paid for a BETA product. I think it was $99. Maybe $50 introductory pricing discount? I can't remember. It was 6 years ago. I paid it. I have a job. No big deal.
  • Then I paid for GM:S when it was released. YYG had a special discounted price for people who bought HTML5, to show appreciation for users who supported the beta and provided feedback to them. HTML5 was then discontinued and rolled into GM:S, as a paid extra. I think at this point I had paid a total of $50 or $100 for the original HTML5 beta + $50 for GMS1.
  • Then they started releasing additional stuff. YYC, which was something you had to pay for, then Mac and iOS and Android build targets. They were talking about Symbian OS for a while, it never happened. But then they announced Tizen and Ubuntu build targets, and more and more stuff. Around that time, I didn't relish the prospect of paying $100 each time YYG released a new component, and I realized that for $500 for EVERYTHING plus everything else they released EVER for the life of the 1.x product, it was well worth it, even if I didn't use all of it. It was a lot of money, but I already had $150 in, and they did a sale where you just paid the balance to make $500, so it was only another $350. Which, compared to what I would have had to pay for each of the new modules individually, I was saving money. $350 is a lot of money, but I have a job, and considering the amount of time I spent on playing around with it, it was worth it to me.
  • Then for the next 4-5 years, I spent nothing. Just enjoyed all the new features and upgrades.
  • When the Marketplace came out, I bought assets that did stuff I didn't know how to do, so I could look at the code and figure out how to do that stuff. Great value there.
  • Then when the Humble sale came out, I jumped on that and bought $1800 worth of GMS (which I didn't need another license for, but so what, I can gift it to someone) and ALL THAT DELICIOUS SOURCE CODE from commercial games. I haven't even gone through it all. MAN what a learning reference that is.
  • Then I paid $50 for the GMS2 Beta, which means I own Desktop when it comes out of Beta, for JUST $50.
  • When GMS2Web is released, I intend to buy it, so I can build for HTML5. That will run me another $75, so $125 total.
  • I don't like mobile games much, have never done a build for iOS or Android, and so am not likely to buy Mobile or Console bundles when they're released. If I ever need to, they're there, and maybe someday they'll go on sale and I'll feel like it, but I'm not that worried. $400 + $??? saved for me. So all together, I'll end up spending $125 for all the stuff that I ever used in GMS1MC.
  • But if I made Android games and wanted to continue doing so because I expected to make money from it? You bet I'd drop $400 on Mobile, deduct it as a business expense, and make $400 from revenue generated by the games I build with it.

If GMS2 is to be paid at such high prices because it's way out of what GMS was and not the same products, then, call Ultimate Game Creation Studio from YYG and NOT GameMaker Studio 2. I would have understood that much better. But it's GMS2, Not UGCS. I think that shelling out another 60$ to keep me updated and with the same things I paid earlier before is not to much asked and I'm not exagerating.
Naming it something else is irrelevant. It's a new codebase, a sequel to GMS1.x, and will import your old projects from 1.4 and convert them to run in 2.0 in most cases.

If $60 is too much for you, don't buy it. How much have you spent on GM/GMS over the years, and how much does that average out per year?

How many users like you would GMS need in order to generate revenues sufficient to keep YYG operating, providing ongoing support and new features for the product, without which the version you have now would stop being useful as the platforms it builds for are updated, necessitating maintenance?

I'll say that again a different way. Suppose YYG stopped development on GMS entirely, today. Within a fairly short amount of time, say 1-2 years, games built on the last build of GMS would stop working on the latest Android, because of updates to the Android platform that break stuff in GMS. Stuff that YYG continuously have to maintain to keep working with the latest Android. That maintenance is necessary, and not free. If you want that, it's going to take more than $60 every 5-6 years from the subset of GMS users who purchase Mobile.

Again, I can't believe that people try to please YYG with their answers by saying that they are OK with the prices they set for existing long term customers over 50$ AGAIN. It seems that people just LOVE shelling out money just at one place. Would anyone want to pay 60$ for GMS2 for 3 of their existing, already paid, export modules from GMS1? Would that please anyone?
You talk like $60 is a significant proportion of your life savings. How many hours does it take for you to earn $60? How many cups of coffee is that at Starbucks? maybe 12? So you're saying that you'd pay Starbucks for coffee for two weeks, but that's too much to give YYG for sophisticated game development engine and environment that builds to multiple platforms?

I'm not asking to pay less than whats presented on the web, I'm just wandering if I'm the only one that thinks he threw his money away on GMS1 when all of what I accumulated so far will get unsupported in a few months as I understood that GMS1 will have no other new stuff which means it just stopped following technology as of GMS2 Beta's release.
How long ago did you buy GMS1? Wasn't that enough time to get good value out of that purchase? If you bought it recently, for full price, then maybe you have a point. I paid $500 about 6 years ago, which averages to <$100/year, so spending another $125 in the next year is pretty consistent from where I stand. And it's not a big deal. I have a job.

If $60 is too much for you to spend on software, what does that $60 mean to you? What do you have to give up if you choose to spend it on GMS2? Medical care? Food? Your home? Something important for your child? No? If you said no, you don't have money problems. You have income problems.

I'd say you should prioritize figuring out how to earn money FAR ahead of making games. Or figure out how to make money by making games. Or develop skill with really good quality FOSS dev tools used by the best programmers all over the world.

$60 is cheap for what you get. +$240 for Mobile, yeah it's a lot more, but if you're making money on Mobile, shut up and pay it. If you're not, figure out how, or stick to cheaper platforms, or switch to free dev tools.
 

makas

Member
clearly you dont understand that you still have what you payed for, you have GMS 1.4 with the modules to work with, that is what you payed for and you still can use it for at least I think a few years, understand this, and also understand that all the versions of gms2 have an amazing 40% discount for GMS1.4 users... if you dont want to pay for those dont do it, and just stay in gms1.4 maybe you will see a bundle for GMS2 in the future...
 
Again I say. 60$ is tolerable for the upgrade BUT, I loose all my previously baught export modules. As mentionned previously, games that you created for HTML5, won't import unless you shell out another 70 bucks or so. Then, the other game you created for Android, you need to shell out another 100$ or so and Oh, great, I can atually export on Windows for just 60$. I'm not talking about income or pocket money, Im saying that we are just paying 2 times for the same things and to me, that's not fair play.
 
N

NPT

Guest
Again I say. 60$ is tolerable for the upgrade BUT, I loose all my previously baught export modules. As mentionned previously, games that you created for HTML5, won't import unless you shell out another 70 bucks or so. Then, the other game you created for Android, you need to shell out another 100$ or so and Oh, great, I can atually export on Windows for just 60$. I'm not talking about income or pocket money, Im saying that we are just paying 2 times for the same things and to me, that's not fair play.
Sounds to me like you bought GM and exports in a Humble Bundle deal and you value it and the exports as a $15 dollar piece of software instead of software worth hundreds of dollars.
 

NeoShade

Member
clearly you dont understand that you still have what you payed for, you have GMS 1.4 with the modules to work with, that is what you payed for and you still can use it
BUT, I loose all my previously baught export modules.
You're missing the point David. As makas said, you still have what you paid for. You haven't "lost" anything.

I remember a few weeks ago in the early days of the beta that somebody likened purchasing GMS2 to purchasing a new car... let's do that again. Imagine that you bought a car - let's call it the '14 model - from a dealer and opted in for all the extras. You got the sun roof, alloy wheels, leather seats, flappy paddle gearbox, and the dealer even through in a set of floor mats. Cool?

Now, a few years down the track you decide to buy a new car from the same manufacturer - we'll call it the '20 model. The car does a similar thing to the old one (i.e. still gets you from one place to another in relative comfort), but other than its function and the basic way that it works, it's completely different - it's got a newly developed engine, a fresh new body and interior look, and the company even underwent a rebranding in those few years, so even the badge on the front is different.

By some miracle you were lucky enough to get a huge discount from the car dealer simply because you'd shopped there before, but that doesn't necessarily mean that he's going to give you all those optional extras that you bought last time for free. And what's more is that you didn't have to sell your old car to buy this new car... It's still a perfectly good car, and it's got the sun roof and leather seats that you're used to. They won't fit in the new car, so if you want those features in the new car, you;re going to have to pay for them, but until then, please feel free to drive your '14 around... nobody will mind.
 

Juju

Member
From the comments made in this subforum (not only by David) and elsewhere, by novices and highly experienced users alike, it's becoming apparent that YYG need to communicate what the improvements are more explicitly. The conception right now is that GMS2 is "GMS1.5"; this is a problem that needs to be addressed otherwise we'll be treading the same ground for the next six months. And that is boring.
 

Nocturne

Friendly Tyrant
Forum Staff
Admin
We do have articles that explain all the new features...

http://help.yoyogames.com/hc/en-us/articles/216757408-Getting-Started-With-GameMaker-Studio-2
http://help.yoyogames.com/hc/en-us/articles/231539867-GameMaker-Studio-2-New-Functions-List

The information about what GMS2 offers is there for everyone to see, and with a minimum of looking (the manual is online and the helpdesk has numerous articles...). It's also made clear in several places that GMS2 is a new product and not an update to 1.4... 1.4 will still work and will still get essential updates for the foreseeable future so if you can't buy 2 (or don't want to) then that's fine, don't buy it.

In my personal opinion, many problems are related to the fact that people are in a "want to but can't" situation and think that YoYo Games should do something about it, however that is not their place and if you can't afford it or don't see its value then don't buy it. If you are making money from your games or are a professional developer, then its an investment and you are spending money to make money, but if you are a hobbyist then it's a luxury item and as such isn't essential (much like video games, or a box of chocolates, or a Bugati...:p ).
 
As my understanding goes then, since a staff member spoke now. It's not the I can't buy situation but here's a major point. I am breaking my head so hard in trying to implement a tile base platform engine to create my other waiting games from this platform including web based games AND android. Now that GMS2 has came out, most of my stuff is already outdated as the layers in rooms make my TBPE unecessary. So, to make this engine worth it and knowing that GMS2 will slowly gain popularity while GMS1 will slowly move away on the market place (for example), I see no point in recreating something that now exists built-in GMS2.

Having that in mind, I have tried GMS2 and have been (not at all pleased with the interface AND with the community stating that bizarre ways to work in Windows are finally just a get used to method when it's clearly just a lack of attention from the creation team) and have been pleased to see the almost OK auto-tile and animated tile engine engine works almost like like a charm. Why the heck would I spend hours in developping the exact same way of working in GMS? I'll just move on. But again, moving on means losing my Android and HTML5 exports because I need to REbuy them. I'm again putting this in foreground, I need to REBUY my export modules. That's why I suggested that 3 pack so that people like me that don't give a heck with iOS and Mac (not that I misrespect those that do, I'm just not into it), paying 60$ US, just for your info, that's just over 80$ Canadian which starts to be pretty expensive for going back to only desktop. So to make you people realize a bit better, HTML5+Android+Windows would cost precisely in US: 389.97$ which in Canadian$ means: 523.57$ (And that's the present DISCOUNTED price, it's not the normal price yet so almost double that amount). Am I starting to make you understand how much money comes out of our pockets here? I live in Quebec and that amount of money is the price of a month house loan.

Now continuing into that same way of thinking - What do I get for this hefty price? Android, iOS, Mac, Windows, Linux and HTML5. What will I be using from here on AND the futur and probably will not change because I'm an Android, Windows and web guy, you've quessed it. MAC, iOS and Linux are totally useless to me and therefore I will have spent half of my house loans money which will be thrown away because it's useless to me. AND don't tell me that I still have the tools, I won't use them. It's like buying myself a bus when I only need a car to go for work.

In a more decent matter with a 3 pack price, let's assume I am just dividing the price in half which here in quebec is worth more than a month of my buisiness' monthly loan (yeah I know, I'm just starting here, I'm a new boss in real life training and times are harsh a lot here in Quebec for small buisinesses like me).

So no matter how the heck I got the export modules Humble Bundle or not, 150$ or 15$. I only need 3 modules and what attracted me at the beginning was the good price YYG had for it's engine. Now, it just boosting up their prices to the other competitors on the market that will give something similar in the end (I'me not talking about all that good stuff GM has, I'm just comparing the final created product here).

As a final note for this comment, YYG is willing to boost the prices up to cleanup their user database and be left with mostly professionnal buisinesses leaving out those same people that began in the game industry because all they could afford was 25$ to begiin their dream in the gaming world. People have made their lives beggin with such a low price and YYG is now killing it because they are now hunting after bigger fish that can afford paying lots of money compared to mister and misses anyone who DO have the skills but just can't afford. To resume, GMS2, once ready, will finish as a torrent file, hacked and cracked much like adobe elements and photoshop and instead of using the YYG marketplace to sell their stuff, they'll simply publish it on other websites or their own making money off of a hacked payed software that they could have afforded if it was more flexible and lower.

That's reality and no matter what you'll say about honesty and honor, that's life on the web. If YYG does not care to be hacked or cracked by these people that just can afford 3 people (I'm not saying I'm going to be hacking it as I'm an honest person trying to show what real life is outside the huge buisiness money making machine).

To resume, having Windows, Android and HTML5 exports means more than 500$ canadian where I could agree that paying arround 120$ for this would be acceptable for me at the max which means in US$ arround 90$ for 3 chosen export modules instead of 6 where 3 of them will never be used.
 
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makas

Member
I do agree that I would like to be able to just buy the exports I want... I hate the idea of the bundled IOS- Androidn thing, but that have nothing to do with no being able to use what you already purchased...
 

Llama_Code

Member
Again however you problem with the $60 pick 3 method is that you are devaluing 2 of the most valuable modules. Your basically saying that should give you Android for $20 and HTML5 for $20. They are worth far more than that when you factor in the potential earning opportunity of them.

If YoYo were to do something like that, it would most likely be more like you can buy each module one at a time but from what they are worth, not a flat price. So you would probably pay $33 for Windows only $150 For HTML5 And $200 for Android.

Baring another end of life firesale before 3 launches they are not going to give you the most valuable modules so cheap.

Software is priced based on recouping development costs and its value in the market. HTML5, Android, and iOS are THE most valuable modules thus the premium price.

If it bothers you so much, keep using 1.4 where you can still use these modules. However new version equals new modules so you have to rebuy them.

Side question - where does most of your revenue come from, Android/iOS, HTML, desktop?
I make most of my revenue from Android and HTML5, previously most of it from Android but this year I made a ton from HTML5 to since I have focused on it more. I never have much luck with Desktop. I did sell a few games to Big Fish Games but those guys are crooks. Desktop i think is more for making games to release yourself.
 

Mike

nobody important
GMC Elder
As my understanding goes then, since a staff member spoke now. It's not the I can't buy situation but here's a major point. I am breaking my head so hard in trying to implement a tile base platform engine to create my other waiting games from this platform including web based games AND android. Now that GMS2 has came out, most of my stuff is already outdated as the layers in rooms make my TBPE unecessary. So, to make this engine worth it and knowing that GMS2 will slowly gain popularity while GMS1 will slowly move away on the market place (for example), I see no point in recreating something that now exists built-in GMS2.`
So... these are PERSONAL opinions, and not company ones.

First, your asking why you should upgrade and pay more. Well, you've just said it here.... we've added new stuff in that saves you doing a ton of work, not only that but it's all nicely integrated into the IDE to make things even easier, so clearly there is stuff in there that is of value.

That said, I find it constantly annoying that we spend years on making something only to have a small number of folk blast us and say it should be free as it's not worth the money, yet you get YEARS of use out of it. Ever buy a DVD? Go to the cinema? Over here that would be about £10 for about 2 hours entertainment - sure you can watch it again, so lets say 10 hours on average. Yet for $99 (about £80 just now) you get years and years worth of use and entertainment. On top of this, you can actually make more than this back if you want to. Even the mobile and HTML5 modules that cost more save you a fortune from a time standpoint, as - you said yourself, it does a load of things you were having to do yourself. I'm pretty sure if you did (say) a Tetris style game then a match 3 game you would charge for both, even though they are block games. Hell, even if you did 2 totally different match 3 games, you still would. You spent time and money on it, and so are entitled to charging for it. Would you expect anyone to demand it for free since they bought your previous games? How about Steam? You buy GTA 4, then GTA 5 comes out... would you "expect" to get hat for free? Clearly it's basically the same game with a pretty look - that should just be an "upgrade" or free!

GMS2 is a new product, we've spent years making it and it cost a lot to do so. You bought 1.x, and you still have full use of that along with any OS/API updates we bring out in the future. Just like any other product, when we put significant effort and resources into it, we have to charge for it; not just to make back the cost, but also to help pay for updates - the time and money spent updating and maintaining them isn't free either. We're a company, and as such we have people to pay. if you can't afford them and do still want them, then I know it's got out of fashion, but saving up usually works. We can't all afford everything we want, but you have to look at the benefits, enjoyment and how much time you'll be able to use it for. Unlike a film, you may well spend night after night using it - to me, that's money well spent. You don't HAVE to buy everything, buy what you need now then save up for when you need something else.

Lastly... we haven't boosted any prices. It's cheaper than 1.x. Sure the bundles are different, but each part is cheaper than before while on top of that you get a huge discount.

We'd all love to buy a Porsche or a Ferrari, perhaps we should demand they lower their prices to something we can ALL afford....
 
I'm not devaluating anything here. I'm just saying that these export modules are ALREADY baught. I have them already! I'm not asking anything free. I'm just saying that these export modules are ALREADY baught. I just want them back without peying exorbitting fees again just because we're at V2. I don't care if V2 is a full rewrite. V2 is not V1 of another software, it's V2 of another already existing software rewritten. To me, if GML persists, if Objects, tiles, backgrounds, sprites and other core functions are still present, then GMS is STILL GMS. I repeat again, I ALREADY baught those modules and just don;t want to pay anothe 100$ dollars to get them back, I ALREADY have them! A pick 3 pack, discounted price for people that ALREADY OWN them would be a nice idea because I ALREADY BAUGHT those export modules.
 

rIKmAN

Member
I'm not devaluating anything here. I'm just saying that these export modules are ALREADY baught. I have them already! I'm not asking anything free. I'm just saying that these export modules are ALREADY baught. I just want them back without peying exorbitting fees again just because we're at V2. I don't care if V2 is a full rewrite. V2 is not V1 of another software, it's V2 of another already existing software rewritten. To me, if GML persists, if Objects, tiles, backgrounds, sprites and other core functions are still present, then GMS is STILL GMS. I repeat again, I ALREADY baught those modules and just don;t want to pay anothe 100$ dollars to get them back, I ALREADY have them! A pick 3 pack, discounted price for people that ALREADY OWN them would be a nice idea because I ALREADY BAUGHT those export modules.
No, you already bought the GMS1 export modules, which will continue to work along with GMS1.
You haven't bought any GMS2 related licences yet.

You don't 'already have them' - you have the GMS1 export modules.

If you don't want to pay for the GMS2 export modules, then don't - it's simple, nobody is holding a gun to your head.

Let's say you do pay $100 for your imaginary 'pick any 3' bundle.
YYG don't make enough money to pay staff to maintain the modules, Android/iOS SDKs change and YYG got out of business - then what?

You've wasted $100 on software that no longer works - and no doubt you'd be in here whining about wanting a refund because you couldn't export anymore.

I'm not sure how old you are, but you're sounding very childish, and repeating the same things over and over and using capital letters doesn't help your cause.

If it's too expensive for you, stick with GMS1 - you still have all the exports you already own available for the foreseeable future.

If you make some money using GMS1 then you can put it towards upgrading, if you don't then Start saving, if you can't do that then I would advise you stop whinging about price and go and learn Unity, Unreal, Godot or one of the many other freely available tools that have no upfront cost.

Repeatedly whining that you want a bundle of any 3 modules for $60 isn't going to change the fact that it isn't going to happen, and I REPEAT AGAIN: You have not already bought GMS2 export modules, you have bought GMS1 export modules which you can happily continue to use, but are not compatible with GMS2.
 

csanyk

Member
I'm not devaluating anything here. I'm just saying that these export modules are ALREADY baught. I have them already! I'm not asking anything free. I'm just saying that these export modules are ALREADY baught. I just want them back without peying exorbitting fees again just because we're at V2. I don't care if V2 is a full rewrite. V2 is not V1 of another software, it's V2 of another already existing software rewritten. To me, if GML persists, if Objects, tiles, backgrounds, sprites and other core functions are still present, then GMS is STILL GMS. I repeat again, I ALREADY baught those modules and just don;t want to pay anothe 100$ dollars to get them back, I ALREADY have them! A pick 3 pack, discounted price for people that ALREADY OWN them would be a nice idea because I ALREADY BAUGHT those export modules.
No, you bought the 1.x versions of those modules.

You STILL own the 1.x versions of those modules. YYG hasn't taken those away from you.

Just continue to do development in 1.x. It is going to continue to be supported for a very long time. Maybe by that time a sale comes around that you can pay close to what you want for the upgrade to 2.x.
 

xot

GMLscripter
GMC Elder
The only problem I have with the new bundling is the Mobile forced bundle.

There's likely a few who want iOS but not Android, or Android and not iOS. Not being able to buy them separately forces people to pay more than they should have to for something they will never need.
I hesitate to join this topic but it does seem strange that the decision to stop bundling modules in a Master Collection, so that folks only need to purchase what the need, doesn't apply here.
 
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Mike

nobody important
GMC Elder
I'm not devaluating anything here. I'm just saying that these export modules are ALREADY baught. I have them already! I'm not asking anything free. I'm just saying that these export modules are ALREADY baught. I just want them back without peying exorbitting fees again just because we're at V2. I don't care if V2 is a full rewrite. V2 is not V1 of another software, it's V2 of another already existing software rewritten. To me, if GML persists, if Objects, tiles, backgrounds, sprites and other core functions are still present, then GMS is STILL GMS. I repeat again, I ALREADY baught those modules and just don;t want to pay anothe 100$ dollars to get them back, I ALREADY have them! A pick 3 pack, discounted price for people that ALREADY OWN them would be a nice idea because I ALREADY BAUGHT those export modules.
Well, as others have said - no, you haven't. The runtime is very different. Are there common parts? Sure. But there's massive changes in there. The entire render loop has been rewritten to be layer based, the whole tile engine is in there, the asset layer is there, the entire animation system has been changed, as in fact has the whole game timing system. Huge changes. And none of this includes all the GML functions and APIs that let you talk to these new things.

So having the "old" modules means nothing, they just don't work with GMS2, it's too different. So just because you look and see a lot of the GML commands the same, doesn't mean in any way that the runtime is the same, it's just not. This is across the board from Windows to Mac to Android to HTML - both WebGL and Canvas mode. HTML5 canvas gets a big boost from the new tile system, just like all the other platform. So there have been huge changes, and lots of work put into them.

So sorry, yes. You have to buy them again, they are just different.
 
The core message trying to be said here, no one even comes close to understanding what I mean. I am NOT saying I lost my exports in GMS1. I am not also criticising the new features in GMS2. All you people that keep putting these things bas, you'rre off track. I'm willing to pay for the new optimized version of GMS BUT, BUT.... Common folks, here's the main issue...That's where things get messy and where I try to focus on...

Game Maker Studio is to developpe games while as export modules are for compiling our games foir a particular system

Did you see my Bold underlined words here? We are precisely talking about exporting games AND NOT CREATING THEM. So let me get back at it ONCE MORE.

If I would have kept Game Maker Pro WITHOUT any export modules THEN, the current Desktop version, offered at 80$ CAD is well worth it as both simply port on Windows, and bla bla bla.

I BAUGHT separately the EXPORT MODULES

Note the underlined bold words again. We are talking about export modules AND NOT GameMaker Studio 2, not the tile functions, not the layer functions, NOT the new graphics functions and NOT all that other cool stuff GMS2 can doo, I AM NOT talking about that AT ALL.. (Note my bold underlined words here again.

If YYG would permit us to CHOOSE which export modules instead of imposing them in the bundles proposed, this post would become positive and a keck of a lot of people would not anymore rethink their purchase.

AND speaking of EXPORT MODULES, note my bold underlined words here again. If I already purchased V1 export modules, it would be just good from YYG and fair for it's customers to permit discounted price for each separate export modules if we already own them. Note again the bold underlined words.

I'm not asking to give out the 3 main modules suggested, Desktop, Web and Portable devices, I'm simply asking to separate the freakin' export modules to permit us to buy those we need AND if we already own them in V1, give a discount as you already are doing. Note the underlined bold words again.

I know someone will probably answer back with those underlined bold words to pin me, I'm already anticipating this.

As an example, check out V1, it permits that ALREADY, just continue that way, it's as simple as that. I created this post for that unique reason. I did not want to cover the good or bads of GMS2, because just for the GUI, there's so much to be imporved that it's not even worth mentionning it here.

So to resume this comment and to bring back the subject on track:

PERMIT TO BUY EXPORT MODULES SEPARATELY GIVING STARTUP DISCOUNTS TO THOSE ALREADY OWNING THEM LIKE YOUR PRESENT BUNDLES FOR PRO AND MASTER.
 

Mike

nobody important
GMC Elder
Okay... this isn't how it was coming over, your post (below) is pretty clear that you think when you buy the desktop module, losing all your other ones is bad - presumably thinking you should get them for free or they should just work.
For 60$, I can only export on Windows and loose all my other export modules. That's an enormous put down to buy V2, I was thinking to buy it this week. Now, it's lost. GMS2 for me is just not worth it for 60$ US, I loose too much.
But fine, if we got you wrong, then not a problem.

As to the bundling, this is a business decision that I can't go into much I'm afraid. This is what's been decided will "work" from a sales pointy of view, so there you go....
I guess, as someone else said, bundling will help subsidise less popular platforms which helps keep GMS2 relevant for developers. After all, if we don't export to all the platforms developers "might" want to export to, then they may well move to another tool in case they want to. It's no surprise that windows is more popular than Mac or Linux, and while we expect Mac to take a jump due to the Mac IDE (whenever that appears), Linux will stay a fringe product.

But it does actually represent better value for the consumer as well, as we can reduce the overall cost of things. This will tend to suit more developers than it doesn't.

As to discounts, if you bought "Android" on GMS, then you will get the same % discount when the mobile bundle appears, and if you bought HTML5 again, you get the same discount when that appears. It's not a case that you've now "used" your only discount, each module you've bought in the past has a discount associated with it, and will be usable when the relevant bundles appear.
 
So as I can understand, FINALLY, is that YYG does not and will never plan to sell each export module individually, am I correct?

If that's the case, well that means that YYG decided to change their customers and want to elliminate the small ones like any biusiness in the work industry does, everyone searhes for the big and rich ones and leave behind the poorer ones. That will also mean that I will need to stick with GMS 1 as I won;t be the type of customer they want anymore.

When I was talking about LOOSING my exports, it's probably my bad as I meant that in V2, I am not able to export web and android anymore and that was something I spent months on gaining the money I needed to have those for my V1. I'm just decieved that YYG won;t let me choose the export modules I work with and constrain me in using bundled pack with exports I'll never use.
 

Nocturne

Friendly Tyrant
Forum Staff
Admin
So as I can understand, FINALLY, is that YYG does not and will never plan to sell each export module individually, am I correct?
No. YoYo Games at the moment has made a business decision to sell them in bundles like this. This may change and nobody has said it will always be like this, just that this is how it is currently.
 
Well in this case, I suggest to change it as it was very usefull for those that could not afford the master collection. So I'm throwing that in for V2, would that be a suggestion you could take into consideration if people would agree to this?
 
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