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GML codin' drainin'

Discussion in 'Game Design, Development And Publishing' started by Misty, Aug 4, 2018.

  1. Misty

    Misty Member

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    So its like I go out an exercise and have a good time. And I have great ideas for glorious games and splendid games.

    But then I go to do the coding. The first 5 minutes I'm pumped. But then its like, I slump in my chair, drained.

    And it's like, I have all these wonderful glorious fantasies in my head, of glorious and colourful legendary games of the amazing fantasia. But then when I go to do them, and it's like the sludge.

    The worst is like, sorting through the lists. And doing routine algorithms. I feel like a slavish secretary doing data entry jobs. And it's like, my head understands the concepts and much of the math equations. But when I go to do it, it never works quite right, because its just a long page of numbers and letters and I can't see what its actually doing till the game loads. And it makes me feel like a robot of code. And it feels like star trek putting in equations. It doesn't make me feel like a real airline pilot, only a cadet on star trek rapidly plugging in equations and algorithms.
     
  2. Smiechu

    Smiechu Member

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    It "Smells like teen spirit"...
     
  3. trg601

    trg601 Member

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    I have a similar problem. I enjoy thinking about games but have trouble motivating myself to make them.
    I think what you should do is look into working with another programmer to pick up some of the load.
    I know working with others is difficult (I don't have a lot of good experience) but it could let you focus more on the game design part of your games.
     
  4. Misty

    Misty Member

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    Nah. Hardly anyone can code as good as me and the one's who can code better than me often end up bloatin' the projects or don't use the same conventions I do, lol. But yeah if Xot or TheSnidr teamed up with me it would be good.
     
  5. Toque

    Toque Member

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    Yes great games take a lot of skill, time and energy and determination.

    And sometimes that’s not enough....
     
  6. Smiechu

    Smiechu Member

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    Just eat more pizza, more chocolate, and play more games. When you'll be smarter, healthier and happier, then everything will go smoother.
     
  7. Lazzeking

    Lazzeking Member

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    To be honest, I had the same problem for a long time cause you know, you have the idea and you are "Oh yeah that sounds cool, let's make this game!" but then you start to write the code and all seems good, after that comes the art pieces (wich for me are mainly pixel art), after that there is music and sfx...a lot of stuff for a single person,and after a while I'll just start to abandon the project...maybe take it back after a while but still, no real deal.

    That's why about a week ago I started working with a pixel artist in a team, so right now I just focus on the code while he is doing the art, and to be honest this really helped me as of right now I just keep going and going and i'm happy with what we're doing.

    So, in the end my advice is to just try to work in a team.
     
    Misty likes this.
  8. BattleRifle BR55

    BattleRifle BR55 Member

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    Maybe it's time to accept that you're merely idealistic. It's easy to think your ideas and skills are greater than anything and anyone else in the world because you find your stuff and your actions to feel unique - well, you're not alone in that feeling. In fact, you are from from being the first person to feel that way. If you need to mention people that actually can code really well AND put out great products, then maybe you should take a step back and wonder if you're just being naive. According to you, you're the greatest developer in the world, capable of changing the industry with your game ideas, but you just don't have the time and need millions of dollars and the aid of other people in order to realize your visions, which should make it clearer that it's less skill and more fantasy. According to you, people who code better than you actually apparently perform "worse" somehow, which really stumps me.

    I'm not saying this to insult you, but I really feel like you're just getting ahead of yourself. I mean, you found it hard to believe that someone could remake (keyword: remake) Facility from Goldeneye in a day when the level is mostly cubes with low-poly models within those cubes, so are you sure you're not just hyping yourself up too much? Maybe you're so caught up in trying to translate your imagination into reality that these blocks feel like the one leaking crack in a dam, just waiting to split open so that everything can finally just break free. Trust me, I know the feeling. My FPS didn't have much single-player content for over half a decade because I felt the same way (though it allowed for multiplayer during this downtime as a result).

    All I can say is to stop thinking about the end, and start thinking about the beginning. Break all the concepts down, piece by piece, like a tournament ladder. Once you start focusing on all these small things, you'll see the culmination finally start building towards something worth being proud of. Until then, learn to start being humble, and you'll stop expecting greatness from the very beginning. You'll learn to nurture excellence, not birth it.


    Yeah, I get it, this is more about motivation and vision and whatever the hell instead of skill, but part of that skill is being able to actually work and utilize said skills. If you are as great as you claim to be, stop working solo and go get yourself hired by a triple-A company where you can offload all the things holding you back onto the people that can support you, where deadlines will kick you in the ass and force you to actually do something. If it's just skill, take your talents where they can be actually wielded for the greater good. Until then, to me, you just sound more like Groose than any sort of Misty.
     
  9. Misty

    Misty Member

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    Its not fantasy to expect the same budget other game devs get to have.

    When did I say I was good at making 3d models? I never said I was good at making 3d models.

    For multiplayer you still have to make 3d levels and characters, and AI sometimes too. I don't see how the multiplayer is that much easier.

    Asking for a million dollars is being humble, when many triple A budgets have 100 million dollars. Although, it could be argued as pride, because I am saying I could make a better game than them, using only a fraction of the budget. So asking for 100 million dollars would be more humble.

    I suspect those companies are judgey and make you take "personality tests" like common stores, before hirering. And if they did hire me, I would just be a cog a drone a slave, with no say in the development of the game. Also I dont want to code in C, I want to code in game maker.

    Misty is an abrasive tomboy who has a burnt and broken bicycle she can't use. When her abusive sisters handed Ash the Cerulean gym badge she demanded that they take it back and then fought ash in a real battle, and won, but then her sistsers said ash was going easy on her, so she reluctantly gave the badge. Misty, like everyone else, was training to be the best pokemon master like everyone else.

    Groose. If I had a crush on Zelda, I would not be jealous of Link, cause he never gets laid with Zelda, so if I was groose, that would not have been my plan.
     
  10. Toque

    Toque Member

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    Finishing a game is never easy. I think part of being a great developer is getting things done. A good game on budget on time.

    For most of us it’s just a hobby so it doesn’t really matter.

    When it’s paying the bills that’s a good motivator.
     
  11. Dragon Studios

    Dragon Studios Member

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    It isn't humble when you can't prove that you're as good as you claim to be. You can't get investments if you don't have something to prove that you're worth investing in, and you can't prove you're worth investing in if you don't make anything. The companies making $100m games have never started off with that amount, why should you be any different?

    Try making the game you can make today. Think small. You'll never make a game on a AAA scale without working with a large team and investors, it just won't happen, but you can still make a successful small game.
     
    Misty likes this.
  12. Smiechu

    Smiechu Member

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    The difference between burnout and plain laziness is very subtle becouse the symptoms are quite the same, only the causes are different.

    Burnout occurs after very long period (months, years...) of intense work within the same topic/environment/repetitive actions etc...
    It happens mostly when the reward for the amount of work which is done and must still be done stops being so attractive for the person as alternatives, or simply when the body and/or the brain is to tired to carry on with the load.

    Lazieness occurs when almost nothing is done,after short periods of work.
    It happens mostly when the immediate "alternatives" are overwhelmingly more attractive for the person than long-term rewards.

    In case of @Misty we are talking about pure laziness. He made nothing and when he tries to do anythig his brain tells him "stop it, there are 1000s more attractive things to, go eat pizza and play games".
    There are ways to change it. Simple forcing yourself to do something isn't enough. You need to get rid of all/most things that are for you more attractive than that what you want to do. Sell your consoles, stop eating pizza, move out from your mutter, uninstall all the games from your computer, move to a town where you have no friends... or simply change your priorities.
     
  13. Misty

    Misty Member

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    Fake news.

    I have made tons of stuff, I am a workaholic the opposite of lazy. The thing is just, brain drain and no air conditioning. Its like sitting all day at the computer problem-solving constantly is so draining to me.
     
  14. rIKmAN

    rIKmAN Member

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    Cool, got any links so we can take a look?
     
  15. Smiechu

    Smiechu Member

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    ... or ware you doing? "I have made" means you have finished something.
     
  16. Toque

    Toque Member

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    I don’t think I could make games in sweltering heat. I’m more used to cold.

    Cooling strategies might be beneficial. Or Work from 5 am to noon.
     
    SnotWaffle Studios likes this.
  17. Misty

    Misty Member

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    Messes up my Cicadian rythms.

    I have shown stuff to gmc already, also in my sig is 2nd place at game jam. I have other stuff I made but not planning on showing at this moment.
     
  18. Toque

    Toque Member

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    Well you might just have to wait out for cooler weather. Snow can fall here in September so won’t be long.
     
  19. Misty

    Misty Member

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    Don't like the cold either.
     
  20. Toque

    Toque Member

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    NOBODY likes cold weather in September!

    Luckily we have things to burn and stay at a moderate warm temperature 8 months of the year.

    Assuming warm is agreeable.
     
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2018
  21. RichHopelessComposer

    RichHopelessComposer Member

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    @BattleRifle BR55: You addressed Misty, but I think I most of the rest of us heard it clearer. =')

    Everyone ends up happier when they're honest with themselves and working earnestly. Everyone needs to hear this advice once in awhile. Good post, thanks!
     
  22. Kurtis2

    Kurtis2 Member

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    That's reality setting in.

    Means you have advanced along the Dunning Krueger graph. So this isn't a bad thing really.
     
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  23. BattleRifle BR55

    BattleRifle BR55 Member

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    Budget for what, though? Are you paying yearly salaries for an entire team with outstanding credentials or something? Also, it IS fantasy to expect the same budget, the same way it'd be fantasy for everyone here to expect to be a millionaire after releasing their first epic game. Why are you expecting such a budget? You sound really entitled. They get to have those budgets because publishers are willing to pay for proven studios, so why not make a team, build a worthwhile portfolio and go seek a publisher?

    I was talking about your overall skills, not specifically 3D modelling. However, if you are stating that you're not good at making models, you made a pretty bold claim as to how long it would take to remake levels from a 1997 N64 game with modern toolsets, which is what I was challenging.

    You missed my point on that. I was merely saying that multiplayer was an experimentation while I spent time trying to figure out how to take my ideas and vision for my campaign and somehow turn them into reality without much compromise, which then became a prominent part of the game. However, designing an arena multiplayer map takes way less effort than any lengthy campaign map, strictly speaking in terms of modelling; I'd think that would be obvious.

    It only looks humble because you keep drawing odd comparisons. Me stealing somebody's wallet shouldn't be a crime because at least I'm not an armed 3-man team taking hostages during a bank robbery, but it still is. Claiming that you can make a better game the way you are doing so is not pride, it's arrogance, especially coming from someone whose resume proudly includes coming second in a game jam. I still don't understand why you keep thinking you need money and a team to prove you're the best in the world. Maybe you should just sell your ideas then, if not having those things is really holding you back. I hope my FPS, despite not being all that unique from a gameplay perspective, will be successful once it launches, but I'm not living in my imagination blaming external forces as to why I'm not already driving an Aventador as a result of changing the industry. I've been putting in the years to make up for my lack of a team, to make up for my lack of a budget. All I see from you is a bunch of claims and excuses as to why you're not trying, which is far from humility.

    Well, yeah, you're joining a team and the company wants to make sure you fit in. You're not working from home and emailing in your dailies. You have to communicate with others face to face, and also not show up to work one day with a shotgun because Annie in sound design just wants to be friends. The reason I suggested you taking your skills to a company is because you hope for- sorry, expect unrealistic things in order to fulfill what you want, and my suggestion is to start from the bottom and work your way up if you're not willing to do it all from scratch by yourself. Whether indie or AAA, nobody's going to just hand you a team and a large budget if you have nothing to prove. @Dragon Studios states this perfectly.

    It really sounds like you just want to be a leader, not that you actually have anything to prove. If you had a team under you, they'd be doing what you'd be ordering because you're the one with the world-changing ideas, so they'd have to be your cogs in order to churn out the results you expect. If that isn't the case, and they're providing way more input as to how the game should turn out, then it's not really you being the greatest in the world, it's the team you're a part of, which then goes back to you needing to be humble because you and your supposed world-changing ideas would be nothing without them.
     
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  24. Misty

    Misty Member

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    If it truly is an epic game, they should be entitled to be a millionairre at the very least.
    Especially when companies like EA produce samey crapware like Starwars Battlefront II, or COD #96: "Infinite WW2 warfare" and get hundreds of millions from it somehow.

    I know I'm not that good at modelling because of how long it takes. And I doubt anyone could make the Facility level in 5 hours lol. Again, I asked you to post a video to prove it, but you made up an excuse saying you are too busy (for a game you have been working on for 9 years?) Isn't that evidence enough that it takes more than 5 hours to make a game level?


    In a jam where others had better computers than me and also many of them had a 2 or 3 man team while I was working solo.
    It's also arrogant to believe I could not make a better game than a company like EA or Activision. It is arrogant not to believe I could make a better game than them, they set the bar so low.
    I tried but Tsuka closed my topic. She demanded that I post concept art of my ideas. I explained to her, that George Lucas did not make his own concept art, that he just outsourced other artists, but she just wouldn't hear it.
    Here's the thing. Even though you are being irritating to me, the truth is the truth and what's objective is objective. If your game flops, you can't really blame yourself for it, I mean you worked all on your own without even a friggin team. Who can fault you for that? You've been convinced by American materialism and unrealistic social expectations to view yourself as some kind of Da Vinci one-man wonder. It's fine if you are truly are a Da Vinci but don't think less of yourself if you can't build Rome in a day (or in your case, 9 years.)
    Not gonna waste 10 years of my life working for someone else for a potential chance to be recognized as a DaVinci.

    Do you know, Bill Gates just started in his garage with a couple buddies, and that was that.

    True, and I'm not arguing that, what I'm arguing is about the corporate strangehold that makes it harder for next-gen AAA indie teams to form in the first place. I mean, it is actually ridiculous and unfair that you were forced to work on a FPS game for 9 years all alone. (Though, the GMC is a good avenue to escape that strangehold and form indie-teams of your own.)
     
  25. Orak

    Orak Member

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  26. Misty

    Misty Member

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    Also, the Dunning Krueger graph says different than what you believe. It says that people who think they can do better, usually actually can do better.

    Here is the real Dunning Krueger one (not the fake news one the internet has got you to believe.)
    https://graphpaperdiaries.com/2017/08/20/the-real-dunning-kruger-graph/

    So yeah you can post your microaggressions at me and try to haze me, but it doesn't faze me.
     
  27. Smiechu

    Smiechu Member

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    I've already said that... you can design games so they make milions of dollars income, or you can make masterpieces which nobody wants to play, or when you have luck - both. They both will be good games in their category.

    You mean Steve Jobs... Bill Gates was approx 50 when Microsoft skyrocketed on the market, and he didn't done anythig creative, just bough and realesed ideas of other genius peaple. Similar with Tesla - Edison story.
     
  28. Misty

    Misty Member

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    By "masterpieces" I am getting the feeling you are referring to those non-violent, minimalist, artsy farts games that are supposed to be some kind of avante-garde novel.
    The equivalent of gaming caviar, kind of have to have a certain mindset to want to play it. Not a big mystery why many of those games fail to captivate players.

    Tesla was still a millionaire I believe. But yes Edison was a butthole and Tesla deserved to have been richer than him (though Tesla was kind of a butthole person in other ways and his philosophy was kind of Darwinian and Third Reich-ish, though he didn't outright kill people like Edison did.)

    Also, Mac sucks, and he refused to change it make it good, so Steve Jobs would be edison and Direct Current.
    (I actually tried to use a mac one time, could not even right click because the mouse had no right click, and the mouse clicks were based on a pressure sensitive, you had a click a different pressure in order to do different things, it was the most asinine and maddening setups I had ever seen. And to save a simple screenshot you had to spread your fingers apart in an awkward manner like playing a hard-guitar solo.)
    Before you blame it on marketing, ask yourself that maybe there is an actual reason noone uses macs.
     
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2018
  29. BattleRifle BR55

    BattleRifle BR55 Member

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    Nobody's entitled to be a millionaire for having great ideas. Ideas are everywhere. Execution is what creates these millionaires. There's no mystery as to why these games are profitable. These are established franchises with loyal fanbases and communities willing to shell out extra cash for skins, buffs, and early access to items and skills. These games thrive on the stupid and willing.

    It's evidence that you still speak from arrogance. A 10 minute walk doesn't take an hour just because an hour long walk does. My game is grander in scale than Goldeneye, so of course it's going to take longer. You chose the magic number of 5 hours, and you claim to have insufficient modelling skills, yet you are unwilling to believe that maybe you might not be right about how long it takes to model rooms made of boxes and boxy structures. Just ask anybody who makes levels for a living how long it would take to recreate such a level and they'll tell you similar things to what I'm saying. Remember - this is about recreating an already-established level, not designing it from scratch. I didn't make up any excuse about being too busy with my game to remake Facility; you have it all backwards. You asked me to prove I can recreate it in a short time period so that you may potentially hire me. I then replied that I don't have any interest in taking time away from my own project to work on another, even if I am getting paid for doing so.

    Did the game that won have better hardware to produce it and more people to have done so? Usually game jams thrive on ideas and execution and not art, no? I was taking the piss with that initial comment, but I really wasn't expecting you to blame your computer which according to you still gets the job done. Better hardware doesn't make for better games, the same way more money and people don't either - otherwise, Battlefront II and CoD WWII would be great games in your eyes.

    Then go hire some concept artists to display your ideas so you can get your topic. If you have money to afford a 3D modeller, you have money to afford a concept artist. Or go elsewhere and see who's interested. You're just selling ideas, the developers don't necessarily need to be using GameMaker.

    I have no idea what your objective with that reply was, as it doesn't really correlate with what you were replying to. My point was that you're sitting around doing nothing but proclaiming that you're broke and unsuccessful because nobody will just hand you money to hire an amazing team to produce your amazing ideas. I, like many others even on this forum, am taking the initiative to fight through these disadvantages in order to still get my ideas out there in the hopes that they'll be worth the struggle. To me, that's the core of being indie.

    Of course, but I was saying that if you struggle to work alone, then work with an established team and maybe one day you'll get to fulfill your ambition, having worked hard for it and seeing how far you have gone instead of sitting here expecting it all to just land in your lap. If you can't get your own ideas down on your own computer, what is having a team under you going to accomplish besides just having people to bounce your ideas off of, something you could easily achieve by opening a thread in this very sub-forum? If Bill Gates apparently started in his garage, what do you need the budget for?

    Next-gen AAA indie teams don't just "form". I don't understand what a corporate stranglehold has to do with forming an indie team. Maybe to make a name for themselves, but not just to form the team. I also chose to work alone. My goal is to translate my outlook on life into a tangible product, and I can't do that through the aid of others - I mean, I technically could, but I don't want to as it would ironically be more work for me to also have to guide a team to do exactly what I'm passing off onto them. If my game is successful, then it would be even more worth it to have gone through this colossal struggle, but I still have a job and a life outside of development. If my game fails, it'll be a devastating blow, but my life will still continue as it currently is, and I'll still have been happy to have created the game I always imagined.


    Listen, I understand your overall point with why you want a team and about how you can see through all the issues of modern AAA gaming enough to revolutionize the industry, and my goal here isn't to fight with you, but you need to come off this pedestal you're stamping on. There are millions of people out there that feel the same way you do, that can see the flaws in these major AAA games and come up with better solutions to make the games more enjoyable, regardless of whether they're developers or gamers. Go on YouTube and find a bunch of reviewers that are suggesting better alternatives to the terrible ideas ending up in these major titles. What separates you from them? If both you and they had a talented team funded for three years, the only difference between you and them is an extra programmer. This is how you are coming across as arrogant and idealistic. You chalk yourself up to be this grand leader, but also make it clear that a good leader needs good followers. It's a contradiction that the one thing you want to stand out in the industry is the one thing that would make you blend in. You can't even get your ideas onto your computer, the very essence of this topic you created. It's one thing to have grand ideas and feel you're the best in the world, but you have to come down from the clouds and realize that execution is a big part of all of this. Everyone has imagination, and imagination is always grander and more impressive than execution. Everybody wants to know what's in the briefcase in Pulp Fiction, but any reveal would never compare to what people were imagining. I bet @RichHopelessComposer has the same high-flying moments you do - the difference is that he's got a WIP topic boasting dozens of pictures of amazing art assets leading to a product that could change his life, and you're here complaining about being drained and a lack of talented people supporting your visions.

    This is why I'm asking you to start being humble and stop looking at the grand scheme of things. You can't get your amazing ideas onto your computer because you're seeing the end goal and all the major steps it would take to get there. You don't feel in charge of your own work because you can't translate your mind properly through your fingers. Stop thinking about how great you are, and start thinking about what it will take to actually become great. It will help with actually getting started, which is always the hardest part about making great visions become reality.
     
  30. Siolfor the Jackal

    Siolfor the Jackal Member

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    Oh, by the way. I don't have a video timelapse, but I did recreate the Facility map in less than a day for a FPS I used to play a lot. I had never used any 3d modelling software before either. I do have screenshots though.
     
  31. Toque

    Toque Member

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    This is the BEST time for solo and small teams to make the next great game!!!! This was near impossible ten years ago.

    Steve and Bill Gates got the job done. I have to respect that.

    Reminds of the criticism of Wayne Gretzky. It was easy to score all the goals and break all the records...... Small goalie equipment, slower smaller players, he had thugs protecting him............

    His response "If it was so easy why wasn't anyone else doing it?"

    And he was right!
     
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  32. Toque

    Toque Member

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    I was never a mac guy. My wife bought an iMac ten years ago and was annoyed.....but...... Still works great and use it today.
    Bought a MacBook air 6 years ago. Cheapest one I could find. Loved that computer. And I dont love a lot of things. Used it for game development until 2 weeks ago when I was cleaning and broke it. Ran really we'll. Did everything I needed so well.

    Bought another MacBook.

    Don't hate windows. But I love my mac.
     
  33. Misty

    Misty Member

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    Halo has is bigger scale than goldeneye, doesn't mean it takes longer to make Halo levels. Mostly its outdoors terrain levels with items plopped onto the terrain.

    K, how do I contact these experts of yours? If you don't know I'm gonna go onto a modelling forum and ask.

    I asked not just to hire you, but to prove that it could be done. Because it seems far-fetched that it can, and also that you have a convenient excuse as to why you can't show me it can be done.
    Also, if you have been working on your game for 9 years, what's another 10 hours? (5 hours for you showing me it can be done, 5 hours for the next paid job.)

    The game that won had two people, a programmer and artist. And they also won Best Presentation and Story. So I was playing the contest with a handicap, I had to make sub-par graphics by myself. And the art does effect the game. If people get a headache/bellyache while playing they will not enjoy the gameplay or story as much (or in some cases, at all. Though my graphics were not that bad, obviously, since I won 2nd place.) Furthermore, art and graphics are often used as visual rewards, like a carrot on the stick, to keep players hooked on the game.

    For commercial games it gets the job done. But for GM Jams you have a time constraint. And there is freezing and lagging sometimes when I do stuff, like load sounds. For instance when I browse flash sound websites, it freezes for minutes and makes me lose time on the jam. The lag also destabilizes my emotions and make me lose focus and positivity.

    The simple fact is I can't afford to use motion capture on a budget less than 8000 dollars. And something like 16000 would give me the high end mocap software instead of the low end stuff. And I would also need to buy a better computer so that the motion cap and modelling programs do not freeze up. And I would also like to hire high quality 3d artists to make the models for me. And I want high quality musical keyboards for great music. And a computer with no lag that can do high quality music with no lag. All that stuff takes cash.
    And no it shouldn't take 200 million dollars to pump out a turd like CoD WWII. But a million dollars is a safe bet and the low end of the spectrum.
    You are missing the point. If I hire concept artists to show my ideas, then I am giving my ideas away for free and opening up to the possibility of people stealing them. I said I would give ideas for the price of 100k each to companies like EA. Such a price is reasonable, since they average 200 million on games anyway, and compared to the profits they will make I will get hardly anything for my ideas. If I show pictures of the ideas, it gives away ideas and defeats the whole purpose of selling my ideas, which you and Tsuka just don't seem to get.

    When did I say I was sitting around doing nothing? That's your fake news not mine. I was saying I don't have a decent million dollar budget like these AAA companies who expect 200 million dollars before they start working on their game. And I said it's humble to ask for 1 million dollars anyway. Do you know the Ouya asked for 8.5 million dollars and they got it in less than 24 hours? Because people had faith in the Ouya developers. Even though the faith was delusional and the Ouya was a flopped console (even the physical design was nonsensical, instead of resting on it's flatside, near it's center of mass, it rests on it's curved side and it is top heavy. And the Ouya had lag and had trouble rendering games with details to them. And you needed internet to download games because there was no plans to sell physical games for the console. Another thing people don't get: There is a certain novelty and a sense of ownership to holding a physical game in your hand, and doing everything exclusively digital kind of sucks the soul out of it.)

    Bill Gates had a team and also probably a decent budget to begin with (though don't quote me on the last part.) I don't even have the budget to afford 8000 dollars mocap which is a basic tool that most commercial game devs get to have. And most commercial devs get to have teams of 3d artists who work around the clock. And they do not just have 3d modelers. First, they have an idea guy, who doesn't really draw much of anything, who chooses 2d artists to draw his vision of the game. They have a guy who has no idea how to 3d model, and just makes cool artwork. Then they have a guy who transcribes the 3d artwork into 3d models. So at the minimum they get 3 artists, but usually have much more.

    The corporate strangehold is just the fact that corporations always seem to have infinite resources to make these corporate think-tank homogenized games. And no matter how mediocre the gameplay, infinite lackeys to always buy and freely promote their games no matter how bad. And then lackey reviewers, who always seem to give their games high rating reviews, or at least, higher seeming than the game actually is. And they always seem to have an easy pipeline to put their games into physical space (ending up at stores like Gamestop or Family Video.) Whereas indie games, can only hope to get digital downloads and no TV coverage. If they get press coverage it is mild usually.
    And then, you always hear success stories of how these successful indies made 100k from a kickstarter or patreon. But you never hear the sob story of indies who try to make a patreon but get 0 donations.

    And also, I'm not willing to invest 9 years of my life to make a game that may flop. Sorry that's not me. But it is another example of the absurdity indies are expected to endure, while corporations always get to walk on easy street.


    I'm not here to fight you. I'm here to help you. Firstly, by offering you money for your talents. Second, by getting you to recognize the Darwinist mentality that plagues society. Everyone has this mindset that they need to prove themselves and struggle to reach the top. That corporate monopolies want you to believe in the struggle, and Darwinist ideas so that people believe in the "American Dream" and that "If I just work hard for 9 years someday I have a chance." Well maybe you do have a chance, but you missed that it is ridiculous to have to work hard for 9 years in the first place.

    I am still better than them. For example, watched all the reviews of Mario Kart 8. Not one touched upon the physics model. Most are concerned with trivialities: Making sure Yoshi has many colors to choose from. Making fun of Pink Gold Peach. And saying the tracks are "boring" if there isn't a million things going on in it at one time, but then simultaneously complaining if a track does have some stuff going on in it. Rank amateurs, not real game designers. Their subconscious detects something wrong with the game. But their consciousness is too fuzzy to really understand what it is. So they start nitpicking about fringe elements, maybe it was the character selection, or maybe flaws with the HD? to place the blame.

    And then on the other side of the spectrum, you have the "experts". The college kids who studied game design, who will tell you every little thing about it. How to "juice" your game, how to balance levels and make games feel intuitive. And they focus so much on the technical, that when you play their game, you have this empty feeling, like the game forgot one important part: its soul.

    What would make me blend in exactly?
    In that case you have to come down from the clouds and realize that money talks. Why is it I can't get my ideas to computer? Could be I don't have money to afford the essential tech, like 8000 dollar mocap.

    EA games has 200+ employees working on a game. I have to make a game all by myself or with myself and an artist. So my workload is much higher than EA which can hire multiple programmers just for one game.
    Actually, that's probably wrong, because EA games works their employees like slaves, so my workload is probably less actually. But still I could use massages for my aching back and a vacation, and then maybe I would not feel so drained.

    It would help if I was a millionairre, and could buy my own team, rather than relying on virtue. For example, let's say I wanted to hire you. But you give me the speech about how you spent 9 years on a game and don't want to work on another project. But would you really stick to the same speech if I offered you 100k to work for me. Suddenly, I would not hear the speech anymore, and your 9 year old game could maybe wait, maybe 1 or 2 extra years for release.

    Screenshots and gifs please.
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2018 at 2:20 PM
  34. Siolfor the Jackal

    Siolfor the Jackal Member

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2016
    Posts:
    407
    I have no gifs. Here are some screenshots. I may have some videos from it inside the game hidden away somewhere.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    I never got around to making any other props like tables or anything but there it is.
     
  35. Smiechu

    Smiechu Member

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2017
    Posts:
    475
    Lol... @Misty
    If you have incerdible gameplay ideas you don't need hi-end arts. You can make a prototype with simple arts and without all the sparkilng graphics etc...
    You just need to concentrate on the inportant things.
    Just do it... show it's really so great as you say, and other talented peaple will be knocking on your doors willing to work on this inceredible project.

    Second thing...
    What do you have for a computer???? Old junk from 1999? Or what? Every prestent day low end PC for 500$ will allow you to work on graphics and music fluently withiout lags.

    Man! Stop complaining and strat working. I don't know what Bill Gates had on the begginig, but without a doubt he was not mumbling publicly how he's not able to fulfill he's dreams becouse he has no money. Jeezz...
     
  36. Misty

    Misty Member

    Joined:
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    Posts:
    736
    Not perfect but not bad. How many hours did it take and what software did you use?

    Or, that untalented rich corporations would steal my ideas and hire better artists to make a generic looking HD game that has no soul. Or that other indie devs, would get inspired by my revolutionary gameplay demos and also ripoff my ideas, making soulful games like Xelphi II which have bad gameplay and graphics, but a soul to the game.

    Nope its 2014. And its good enough for Game Maker games but occasionally freezes when browsin the web or too many programs. Which makes me have a disadvantage, I usually close audacity and do not always leave it open which makes me lose time. Also I don't have photoshop so I have another disadvantage. And my computer lags too much to record MIDI compositions. I paid less than 200 dollars for my machine and it was better than my old computer though.
    My old computer, I paid 500 dollars for and it had heat sink issues, dust would clog up the heat sink and it would lag after only one month, so I would have to take it into a professional and pay them 70 bucks each month for my computer not to overheat. It was a laptop that you had to take apart hundreds of parts to get to the heatsink and badly engineered.

    I don't want to sink in 500$ to a computer that will be worse than the laptop I have now. So what are your ideas for a good 500$ laptop I can get? Desktops are bulky and don't suit my needs.

    I am working but I dont boast about it publically. What I try to make public is my desire to have kickstarters and patreons who just wants to make AAA games like everyone else.
     
  37. Siolfor the Jackal

    Siolfor the Jackal Member

    Joined:
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    Posts:
    407
    I used a program called Sketchup to model and texture the map(original textures ripped from the rom). I had never used it before so recreating Facility was my way of learning the toolset.
    It probably took me about an hour or so walking around the original Facility map to make a floor plan myself(basically counting tiles and comparing room and door sizes). Then it took about an hour and a half to get used to the tools. After that it came togethe pretty quick. I'd estimate it took around three and a bit hours to lay out all the rooms, then an hour of tweaking to make them match up perfectly and add some smaller details. Then about 20 minutes to texture it all.
    Sidenote: My cheap PC is about 7-8 years old and still more than enough to use stuff like this as well as various audio tools. You don't need a good PC to compose midi, not sure about playing it because I use a sequencer and place notes manually.
     
  38. BattleRifle BR55

    BattleRifle BR55 Member

    Joined:
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    Posts:
    747
    True, but how does that disprove my claim? I did say my game was on the scale of a Halo title, but I never said my environments were mostly terrain. My game taking a long time doesn't mean a Goldeneye map would, too. A height map and a script to read it into a model would be way faster to produce than a detailed Goldeneye map, but a level comprised of square rooms and rectangle hallways would not take weeks because a map of a detailed city section would take months.

    It was never about my "experts" and that I'm 100% right and you're absolutely wrong, it was that if you don't model and therefore will just take a guess and then later stand by that assumption as if it was fact until someone showed you otherwise (like @Siolfor the Jackal just did), it just comes off as being closed-minded and foolishly assertive which was why I suggested you just ask somebody else for their opinion if you weren't going to take only mine, or at the very least not hold yours so strongly. I mean, your attitude on the matter was off-putting and it's why I wasn't going to waste an afternoon building the level just to get you to open your eyes and pull your fingers out from your ears; I had better things to do, like working on my own game because it's already been long enough. While I do freelance work from time to time, I currently have no interest in modelling for other people because I don't care to spend time on other projects when I could be working on my own. I appreciate the opportunity you're offering. I'm not against working for some extra cash, but I don't need your money. I'm not a broke developer living on ramen in my tiny, unfurnished apartment.

    Actually, never mind all that. If you can just say you're the best at coming up with ideas, why can't I say I'm the best at designing levels and just have you accept it and agree with my fact on the matter? Experts? What experts? I am the expert. Who cares if you think it's far-fetched to make the level so quickly, I think it's totally plausible because Bungie wishes they had me for Destiny and I would have not made their levels so tedious to go through over and over again. It would take me only one hour to make the map, but I need a four hour nap after the first half hour so that I can unwind from all the stress those 30 minutes would give me. I'm right because I say I'm right, so who are you to doubt me?

    I don't think the message was to just give away everything in a thread, but you're not going to get a bunch of resumes in your inbox by merely parroting DJ Khaled. My suggestion was mainly to hire some concept artists to showcase a couple of interesting teases from your ideas asking for members with other necessary skills that can match your needed level of expertise in order to produce these AAA ideas of yours. You won't get your million-dollar team to create a AAA-looking game, but you won't be alone in making your AAA concept that could eventually take you there.

    Sitting around doing nothing in the sense that you're the best, you're the best, but only if "something like 16000 would give me the high end mocap software instead of the low end stuff. And I would also need to buy a better computer so that the motion cap and modelling programs do not freeze up. And I would also like to hire high quality 3d artists to make the models for me. And I want high quality musical keyboards for great music. And a computer with no lag that can do high quality music with no lag." and "It would help if I was a millionairre, and could buy my own team, rather than relying on virtue".

    You keep wanting to start from the point of success in order to further it with even better success, rather than the humble beginnings of a garage setup. You're just one guy with a less-than-stellar laptop, but you keep asking for the same opportunities that commercial game devs have because you know you're better than all of them out there. Your budgeted beginning could start by doing what we other folks are doing - saving up money from working jobs we don't want to. It's going to cost me whatever thousands to get the licenses and export modules to port my title to the consoles, but I've got the money saved up for it by working for it, rather than hoping someone will just hand it to me because I feel I deserve it because I'm better than Bungie. I mean, with what I have to offer, I don't doubt I could get it easily funded, but I don't want any other hands in my cookie jar, especially when I can already easily afford it myself. Money comes from proven abilities, if not just plain risk-taking, but just saying you're the best isn't going to get you anywhere.

    There are plenty of ideas that get funded but don't pan out. The Ouya is no special story; in fact, let's look at two projects that I'd argue were even more promising, Mighty No 9 and Yooka-Laylee. Both were developed by former employees of their originating franchises, were intensely crowd-funding, had plenty of media coverage and hype from anticipating fans, released digitally as well as physically on consoles, and yet both failed hard for the same reasons. How about Cliff Bleszinski with Unreal and Gears of War under his belt, trying to push out another of his billion-dollar IP ideas?

    How do we know that if someone gave you a small loan of a million dollars you wouldn't be another failure story? How are you so sure your ideas are as grand and world-changing as you claim when many others who held the same opinions and luckily had the exact opportunities you pine for collapsed hard during their moment in the spotlight? You keep saying budget is holding you back from changing the world, but all we know of your true potential talent is your word that you're better than EA and Activision. You go on about humility all the wrong way. It's not humble to ask for a million dollars, the same way it's not humble to say you're better than two big publishers. You want to work well beyond your means by having all sorts of fancy equipment and talented employees working under you and you have no proven track record to show you deserve it. You think it's wrong that people have to work hard to reach the top instead of just starting there and only having to prove why they should remain there. You want to skip the beginnings with the garage workplace and inept hardware and get straight to the fancy office with daily massages. You want to be Gears of War before you're Jazz Jackrabbit. You're the best because you say so. That's not humility.

    I get what you're saying, but it comes across like the person who would rather get in the unemployment line with a chip on his shoulder than the job fair line hoping to turn his life around. Rather than playing the game, you want the rules to change to allow for you to work the way you're used to.

    Since the subject of my development period keeps coming up, I'll address it. I didn't work for 12 years (not 9, unfortunately) expecting to make it big in the game industry. I haven't been sitting here not realizing the years are just floating on by while I'm dreaming of fame and Lamborghinis. Think about what the indie scene was like back in '06, think about the reputation Steam still had, and that console releases were completely unrealistic. My game was a small-scale hobby project that I worked on for several years before I saw potential in it and started it over from scratch (twice) in order to fulfill the original, grand vision that was birthed from my disappointment with Halo 2's release versus its initial promise. I didn't know programming before working on this game, and I went to college right out of high school for computer programming as the goal was for my uncle to hook me up with a cushy job, eventually that being at Oracle. The project was also practically on hiatus for nearly two years because of a terrible breakup that completely changed the course of my life. I wish I could have released my game years ago but, regardless of my life interferences, that wasn't possible because the game was never initially envisioned as what it eventually became. Releasing this game to success would be a dream come true, but I still have a job and other opportunities on the horizon because working hard for what you want is the only way to get it.

    If you want to get to the top, you have to fight for it. The mentality that plagues society is that everybody deserves being at the top, regardless of opportunity or starting position, whether they actually deserve it or not. The reality is that those who actually reach the top didn't think solely about what they didn't have, they focused on what they did, used it to their advantage, and hustled their way through every ladder of success until they achieved their dream. They didn't run around claiming they're the best and deserve handouts. Those that got to the top without that struggle were aided by luck, not skill. Winning the lottery next week would get you the budget you need to acquire all the equipment and team members you need to make your AAA game, but unless you know for sure that's going to happen, you might as well put in the effort and hours to make up for that lack of luck.

    And then you have the guy who's short of a million dollars to change the world with his revolutionary ideas. I mean, all I really got out of all that is that you, of all the people in the world, hold all the correct opinions, but you have nothing to prove that besides your own reaffirmation. Mario Kart 8 received glowing praise from both critics and players, but it sucks because you say so. I read your nonsensical thread about it, nonsensical in the sense that your proof Double Dash was the best was because 8 had issues. Well, WWII is the best Call of Duty because Black Ops Declassified is the worst. Snickers is the best because Mars sucks. It's not a valid argument. You complained about why nobody got at the core of Mario Kart 8's issues - maybe because these people didn't feel the same way as you - and yet I'm still here wondering why Double Dash is the best without being told why. The core of all your arguments seems to be a single, unshakable claim followed by an unrelated opinion. The reason you're the best is because you can point out the mistakes of others, but that doesn't say why you're the best.

    So this whole thread started just because you're broke and are unwilling to make compromises with your supposed handicaps, and you won't hustle to get the money you need. You want to work outside your scope. You sound like you want to make a game with the looks, depth, and complexity of something like The Division but with the production process of something more like Undertale, with the girl Fox hired to also get under the table a couple times a day.

    Well, yeah. It would also help if I had GMS2 with its YYC and shader cabilities, as well as all my current talents, ideas, and design documents over a decade ago so that my game would have taken 3 solid, productive years instead of the difficult 12, but that's not the reality of either of our situations so we should make due with what we have.
     
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  39. Toque

    Toque Member

    Joined:
    May 25, 2017
    Posts:
    358
    You lost me. It’s too hot to work. I respect that. I get that. Motivation is hard sometimes. Yup. We all feel that.

    Million dollars, Bill gates, shaders..... no clue about those things.

    If you do game dev for a living I hope it works out.
    Maybe a bit of burn out? Take a break?

    Maybe game dev isn’t fun for you anymore?

    Maybe focus on things that you really enjoy about game dev. Inspirational things.

    What would Michelangelo be if he never touched his brush to canvas?


    I hope you find inspiration and motivation and joy in your art and honor in the struggle.
     
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  40. Toque

    Toque Member

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    12 years. Wow. Amazing.

    You only fail when you quit.

    I really hope you do finish it. I can not even imagine how good that would feel.
     
  41. Misty

    Misty Member

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2016
    Posts:
    736
    I doubt Bungie even knows you and also, they are out of business.
    100k is not at all a risk for a billionaire, its like handing out cotton candy to a homeless person. I wasn't expecting poor members of the GMC to have faith in me, only the billionaire rich.

    Don't know anything about DJ Khaled, and I don't care for rap music, so he would not be the guy I'd parrot.

    They both failed because the games were garb. How is that so hard to see? Mighty number 9 got an F- minus, a flippin 50% metascore out of 100. How is that even relevant to me? So some random makes a game that gets an F minus. I plan to release an A+ game. How is that so hard to see? If some baby poops a turd what on earth has that got to do with me?

    Because I'm nothing like those people. Like literally. My personality isn't even the same as them.
    If I have a bar of chocolate. And it tastes better than two big turds. How is it not humble to assume that my chocolate tastes better than turds? Since the bar has just been set so low.

    I do have a proven track record. 2nd place in a game jam. Most views in gmc of one of my games.
    I am trying to get a job. To work as a CEO of a major corporation. I will save EA from themselves.
    There is hope for you yet, you aren't one of those delusional Halo 2 fanboys like everyone else.
    No, not everyone, just me and a handful of others. And maybe you, if you prove that your 9 year old game that you poured your heart and soul into, does not suck.

    It's sucks because it does. What you see on the internet is not reality. My dad does not enjoy playing it. And he enjoys all the other mario kart games. And I have a friend who refuses to play it too. Do you really trust these famous reviewers nowadays? I have seen some of these critics give 9 or 10 star ratings to some of the worst entertainment I have seen.
    Second of all, its a Mario game. All Mario games automatically get sales and hype. Third, the level of suck is not nearly as bad as Yoko and Laylee or Might No 9. After one day of Yoko and Laylee, I was done. But yet I still have urges to play Mario Kart 8. And I did have fun playing other players, but the drifting around every corner gets old. And the single player is a total bore.
    And ask yourself how much of this gets excused by the loyal fans? Do people really rate games like adults? Most of their reviews consist of whining about Pink Gold Peach and not having certain characters in the roster. Does that sound like a mature or valid game reviewer to you?
    And let's say what's obvious and in our face.
    1. The music is objectively good. Even though the music is objectively good, it is unfitting. Most of the songs do not boost adrenaline. Bach may be good. But would you put Bach in a racing game?
    2. Fannuts will excuse anything Nintendo does. Nintendo has a long held tradition of releasing a new mario kart for each new console. And yet, they release the same friggin game, Mario Kart 8, for the switch, and noone even complains. It's almost like a cult. Do you think any of these people think objectively or rationally?
    No they are all bowing to their brazen god, Pink Gold Peach.

    No my argument is Double Dash is the best because it is. Double Dash is a bit boring because I had played all the tracks to death. But if they used the same engine Double Dash 2 would be the best.


    I have told you why but you did not bother to read I guess. I stated objective scientific evidence that the physics of Double Dash were superior. And that playing Mario Kart 8 feels dry. And there is a constant understeer, forcing you to drift at all times! Which alienates casual players and bores the experts, from having to hold RT all day.

    It is reason enough to believe I can make a better game. And leave the art to the artists. But I will have something to say about the art and give them a guiding assist.

    There is nothing that complicated about this. Just ensuring that the programmers do not make sloppy code and connected code that migrates easy. I would have a better computer so hi poly would not be an issue here. Only an issue of console hardware and low-end pc's. Thus LOD options would be desired.

    I don't see how not having shaders cost you 9 years of work? Surely shaders are reserved for bonus things like the particles and shadows. Surely the core framework does not depend on them?
     
  42. Posh Indie

    Posh Indie Member

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2016
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    147
    Credibility lost. *Drops the mic*
     
  43. Misty

    Misty Member

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    Jun 22, 2016
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    736
    People who drop mics have no credibility.

    Plus, my main argument was that AAA indie teams were rare due to corporate strangehold, so your comment was pointless.
     
  44. Toque

    Toque Member

    Joined:
    May 25, 2017
    Posts:
    358
    CEO of EA is more of a business person than games developer. (Andrew Wilson).

    You seem like a misunderstood artist and more suited to lead one of the production teams.

    Or just start your own company. Five years goal to make it a AAA company?
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2018 at 6:05 AM
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  45. Smiechu

    Smiechu Member

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2017
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    475
    With the attitude, ego and social abilities he would better suit as a janitor...

    In companies I worked till now there was always this kind of "wise-guy" - knowing everything better, having a "solution for all company problems", having a licence for objective "truth", always underestimated and misunderstood by evereyone in his opinion... if he could only be the boss, he would show everybody how to lead the company.

    Yeah, but in reality he was only suitible for janitors work. (With all respects to all janitors doing great job.)
     
  46. BattleRifle BR55

    BattleRifle BR55 Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2016
    Posts:
    747
    [​IMG]
    Ya don't say.



    Yes, though I'm not asking for your opinion of their final releases, but of their potential during development. These weren't guys emulating the inspiring titles, these were guys that actually worked on Mega Man and Banjo-Kazooie and had more than enough funding, and even got console releases. They weren't showing up to work just to collect a paycheck and take bets on how low their Metacritic score was going to be. How do you know you're not going to have the same unfortunate outcome if you were given the same opportunities? How do you know your game's not going to fall flat on its face, with features you were damn sure were solid ending up worsening the already broken core experience? And please don't stick to this "I'm different" reasoning because that's not an answer anybody older than 5 would realistically give. ethian's different but he's not putting out a Minecraft-killer any time soon. Just saying you plan to release an A+ game isn't proof at all, it's a wish. Everybody on this forum is planning to launch an A+ game. I hope to release an A+ game as well, but you keep throwing your doubts at me. Why can't I be right too and get your immediate appraisal without question? I have to prove myself but it apparently should already be obvious you're the best.

    I was asking why your opinion should be held over theirs. Why is 8 so objectively bad if it's so beloved by both critics and fans enough to get it in the high 80's on both scales on Metacritic? Regardless of whether it was a good game or not, why are you right and they are all wrong? To repeat, I'm just asking about your opinion's validity versus theirs, not what you or they think of the game.

    I didn't see anything at all about why they were superior, though. Just more complaints about Mario Kart 8's physics. It's like one of my examples: WWII is the absolute best Call of Duty because Black Ops Declassified had a horrible control set up, no real campaign but themed challenge missions with no checkpoints, a bland menu, terrible bot A.I., and it wasn't a unique CoD at all. It was just an edited port of the original Black Ops but dressed up to have a more portable focus by ironically cutting offline content. It didn't even have Zombies at launch, but as paid DLC!

    What about any of that would speak for WWII's quality? Why does Mario Kart 8 being bad automatically make Double Dash good, the best, even? Why doesn't Double Dash suck as well? I have no idea what Double Dash is about or why it is good, I only know your reasons for why you don't really like 8. If I went to read a review about Double Dash and just got a detailed analysis about Crash Nitro Kart's shortcomings, that would tell me absolutely nothing about whether Double Dash would be worth my time; a comparison is not proof because Double Dash could be terrible, too. This is what I meant when I said that you provide an unshakable claim and back it up with something completely unrelated. I have no idea why you're the best, just your word that you are because some big titles suck.

    The shaders didn't cost me time. I'm just saying that my game wouldn't have had almost any of the fancy effects that depend on shaders if it was finished and compiled in GM7 many years ago like it was originally supposed to be, especially shadow mapping, my favourite effect. There still was animation, but any vertex manipulation was all CPU-based, and without the ability to compile, I could have only really gotten use out of it during cutscenes and had to stick to individually-drawn body parts transforming on their own during gameplay, with single-model key frames for distant entities.
     
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  47. Misty

    Misty Member

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2016
    Posts:
    736
    What companies have you worked?

    What abilities do you have?

    I have actually worked as a janitor before. Not my cup of tea, I am allergic to the chemicals. Not a suitable job for a noble, or an aristocrat like me. If I had a cleaning job at least let it be one with dignity, such as a maid or butler. Janitors not the job for me. Nothing but toxic chemicals, suited for the type of people who don't at eat Whole Foods, the type of people who feel at home in a deep polluted city like New York. Me? I belong next to a lake breathing the fresh air. Let me ask you this...are you a McDonalds type of person or a Whole Foods type of person?

    Guys? I watched a video about it and it seemed like it was only one guy, maybe two.
    And if a team is cut in half, then it's 50/50. The team is litterally cut in half, and you get games like TimeSplitters, watered down versions of Goldeneye, or Nuts and Bolts, watered down versions of Banjo Kazooie. And that's when it is cut in half! Imagine what you can get if you cut it by 99%.

    I don't know. Maybe not with Yooka and Laylee, but Mighty no 9 seemed like a mighty attempt at a mighty big cash grab to me.
    Because I have experience in game design, and have been programming since I was twelve, have books on game design, have researched game design, watched videos on game design, have made both failed games and good games (rated by the public), and because I am a critic of both movies and games. Also, been to college for art design, so I know what good art is and what it isn't, went to college for color theory too, (but it mostly went in one ear out the other, but I have this awareness of it still.) I have also went to prestigious art schools, and prestigious schools, meant for elitists. Unlike most game devs I am not shy about how I feel. Most game devs quietly accept mediocrity because they don't want to hurt someone's feelings. Me? If my artist is just not getting the job up to par, I have to demand improvement.

    If I was in charge of Yooka or Might No 9, do you honestly believe I would have accepted the turds that were produced? Maybe if I was on a low budget and working solo that would have been all I could do. But if I was the boss with a salary? No way.

    Highly doubt it. Many don't plan on making an A+ game, just want to make a game for fun and to have a good time.

    Because you never show or update us with your work. It is all a mystery to us. We have nothing to go on. I was actually reading an article, it says for an indie game to gain traction, you must post developer updates and screenshots daily. But I guess you and I do not believe in that philosophy (I believe in the glory of the suprise too.) However the difference is one of my game demos had gotten the most views on the GMC. But in your case, I do not have the slightest idea of what other games you have made in the past. So it's all a mystery to me.

    High 80's is not excellent, but good. I would say Mario Kart 8 is more good than bad. Thus the 8 review would not have surprised me. Especially because of the subconscious association of it being called Mario Kart 8. However, a 7 or 6 would not have surprised me either. A five or a 9 would have surprised me, and I would have claimed bias in the reviewers.
    So what is high 8's, in terms of score? It means B+. A B+ game not an A or even A-. If a student got B+'s his whole life, would you be so proud of him? Or just a guy skating by, a mild effort but rather unremarkable. And then there are the 60 score games. D games. Enjoyable, but have so much flaws. Any score below 60 is an E. Unplayable. Trash. Anything below 50 is an F, unfit for the sewer.
    And then there is reviewer bias. Giving Double Dash only a D (6.5) when it is really an A- (9) game. Biased and unfair reviewers confusing developers into making them believe their gold is crap and their crap is gold.

    Then I will say this, again, which I have said before. Double Dash has better physics. Music with more punch and grit to it. And the cars do not have annoying understeer. And the powerups, are more competive than Mario Kart 8 and less devastating. I did not ever state the powerup thing directly, but it was implied by me complaining about the powerups of 8 being OP. I also said directly, that there is more strategy with Double Dash because you have two extra item slots.

    Double Dash could not be terrible, because I said Mario Kart 8 was not terrible, but was enjoyable to play the online. I said it was a Mountain Dew and Doritos game. They can be enjoyed a certain way, if you do not think about how toxic it is too closely. And if you are not the kind of person who demands Whole Foods level of quality.
     
  48. BattleRifle BR55

    BattleRifle BR55 Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2016
    Posts:
    747
    Good to see you have some credentials, but your points counteract what you say about others that still just make you sound like you're the best because you claim to be. Why are you not one of those college "experts" making games with no soul, and why are high praises of your games from the public valid, but high praises of Mario Kart 8 are not? It's still just you putting yourself on a pedestal when it works in your favour. Your situation is not unique. I'm not discrediting you, I'm just trying to get at the core of what makes you so different despite sharing the same history and attitude as many others. I mean, such a history of yours is similar to many people even in other fields of work. Nobody just climbs out of bed and gets hired for a random career, there's usually history, passion, and schooling behind them. My brother's a pilot, he grew up on flight simulators, did his research, went to college for it, put in the hours in cold, isolated airports, and now works for Air Canada and occasionally teaches other students, despite being way younger than most of his students. It's not as if he's the best pilot in the whole world because of that, though.

    I have experience, I've been programming since I was 11, I have books on game design and have done research. I've released games publicly to general praise (though physically only), I like movies and games beyond mere consumption, and while I went to college for programming specifically, I had to take some game design courses as well, and I left college with some powerful letters of recommendation from several teachers. Could I say with 100% certainty that my FPS will change the world? I couldn't, because what I feel about myself and my game would not necessarily be shared by others.

    Of course not. No one in their right mind would. The real question is, how do you know whether the game is a turd or not before you release it to the public? Again, it's just you saying your game is going to succeed because you say so, because you can recognize whether it's objectively good or complete garb. That's not an answer with any merit, it's being cocky.

    Finally, a valid answer to something. Also, which demo got the most views, if you don't mind me asking?

    That doesn't answer the question, you're just going on about scores. All I'm asking is why your opinions are right and theirs are wrong. It's still just you making a claim without anything to back it up but unrelated stuff. You still haven't answered what gives you that power over the world.

    ...That's still a comparison to Mario Kart 8. I don't think you understand what a review is. "Better physics", for one, is not a review point because it doesn't mean anything on its own, and it means even less to someone who may not have played MK8. I even said that all I got out of the part on physics is that they're better, and your response to that was to just repeat that very thing that I said was unclear. I essentially only read "Double Dash is the best because I say so and because it's better than 8" which is still just the claim followed by unrelated support.
     
  49. Smiechu

    Smiechu Member

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2017
    Posts:
    475
    @BattleRifle BR55
    You are aware that @Misty is a Troll? You won't receive your answers, don't waste your time. @Misty has a licence for truth, just check all previews topics of his/her.

    Mostly newspaper office...
    With a help of a telephone booth I gain abilities to fly, see through walls, stop speeding trains, shoot lasers with my eyes end so on... nothing special.
     
  50. BattleRifle BR55

    BattleRifle BR55 Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2016
    Posts:
    747
    I know Misty's answers will always be the same, but I'm enjoying myself.
     
    Khao, hipstercapitalist and Smiechu like this.

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