can we please stop assuming that this post, and the vast majority of replies in it, are asking experienced users to do all of the work for somebody else?@Nocturne I just won't be bothered to jump through loops to assist someone not willing to do his part, especially if there's this risk of being vilified for it. The responsibility should be on the person seeking assistance to, at the very least, display some amount of willingness to improve and learn instead of being willfully ignorant. You cannot seriously expect experienced users to follow these borderline social-justice guidelines without also having guidelines in place that would force newbies ("rookies" is apparently condescending) to properly conduct themselves. Nobody wants to maliciously discourage newbies from posting, but you'll very soon realize that disincentivizing experienced users from assisting them is a steep and overall counter-productive hill to tread. Newcomers that are turned off by valid criticism - good riddance - competent people actually willing to learn will quickly fill their shoes, which won't be the case for veterans who decide that helping them grow (however sternly) just isn't worth their time. This line of thought where newbies asking for help should dictate authority rather than well-versed experts is so backwards and out of touch.
TLDR; Moderating team should also curate newbie topics rather than exclusively curating feedback. Otherwise this will become the norm. (And for the love of god, instead of just lazily deleting whole posts take your time to actually remove parts which perhaps cross boundaries, you're all better than that)
even in the original post, i think my intentions were quite clear in that i wasn't saying to go above and beyond to make sure a new developer gets spoon-fed to success.
the main points that have been brought up time and time again aren't 'don't say no', they've always been 'can we learn to say no the right way'.
if you think being civil and respectful is borderline social-justice, then i really don't think there's any convincing you that we should just treat others with a degree of compassion.
i want to bring your attention to this post i made in response to frostycat's take on the misconceived idea that the blame has to be on the experienced users.
in that post i mentioned that there was a dialogue between both myself and someone who came across as though they believed they deserved more than anyone would agree with them on.
yes, there are people who expect too much. yes, there are people who are ungrateful and will undervalue even the constructive advice they're given, but those are very few.
sometimes all it takes to kindly remind them that we can't babysit them and that they need to try elsewhere, like maybe the manual. etiquette also isn't explained to you until you get used to how things work, so explain it if you must.
as for copying code, if you don't want to deal with that inevitable trainwreck, then just stay clear. nobody is forcing you to engage. at that point you're just willingly throwing yourself into the inferno and complaining when you get burned.
maybe they'll learn not to copy code on their own, maybe they won't, but in the grander scheme of things it's just another mistake to learn from if they're willing.
if they aren't willing to learn from it and actually put the time into learning how to do things properly, then they'll suffer the consequences.
the thing is, being the experienced users whether long term or otherwise, we understand how things should be and should ensure others do too before attacking them.
honestly, sometimes it feels as though people are trying to find any reason they can to justify being mean to other users and i just don't get it.
if you aren't willing to be patient and explain things that might seem obvious to more experienced users like ourselves, then maybe giving advice isn't the right thing to do.
your first reply in the link you provided was more than reasonable. you didn't go out of your way to shame the person, and i'd argue that it's a perfect example of what criticism should be like.
i don't really know if your reply was in reference to something specific that nocturne said, but as there was no quote, i'm left to just figure it out.
i'm sorry if this comes off as some kind of attack, but i really do think that people are missing the point for the sake of justifying questionable actions and behaviour. let's not do that.