Opinion Calling Out to All Atheists

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signal

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If the Earth was flat, the ocean's horizon would always look flat, no matter how far you zoomed in. It looks choppy when zoomed in because when you zoom in enough, you can see the final waves possible to see before the waves behind them are hidden from the Earth's curve. It's obvious just from looking at the photos. You can see nice chunky waves and then.....nothing behind them suddenly. That could only happen on a sphere.
Correction: That CANNOT happen on a sphere! The curve would have to be extremely sharp, thus not a curve, for that to happen.
 
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signal

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Think about what you're saying.. The next set of waves behind the waves you're talking about would have to drop off dramatically to be obscured behind the waves in front of them.
 
Think about what you're saying.. The next set of waves behind the waves you're talking about would have to drop off dramatically to be obscured behind the waves in front of them.
No, they wouldn't. They'd have to drop off enough to be obscured...that's all. Take a look at a basketball. Look at the little bumps all over it. They're... almost like waves! Now...look closely, and marvel at how at the very edge of the basketball, you can no longer see the bumps further from you because of the bumps in front of them.

.....Maybe the basketball is flat? :p
 

Nocturne

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@Nocturne Hmm, I don't now where you live.. but I don't live on a pear. That's clear as day. No amount of Maths is going to prove otherwise, either. So, is a math equation your proof? With all the "millions and millions of times" it's been proven, the mathematics of a sphere is your proof that we live on a pear? To each their own. I'm going to continue questioning everything in my reality. Maybe one day, when I'm presented concrete proof of some magical pear floating and spinning in a void of nothingness, I'll jump aboard.
Lol! Yep, that's real logical reasoning on show there! Avoid 99% of may argument and also ignore the request for proof that established wisdom is incorrect, all the while stating that you don't believe in the very thing that permits you to type this crap and live your life! And what's with this "pear" business? The earth is spherical (okay it's actually a spheroid, but hey, since you don't seem to believe in maths that's obviously not important anyway), and no one here except you has made any claims to the contrary...

@Nocturne, the mathematics of a sphere is your proof that we live on a pear?
The mathematics of a sphere EXTRAPOLATED into the real world and used in the real world in verifiable experiments that no matter where or when I do them will always give the same results is a pretty solid proof that we live on a sphere.

@Nocturne 'm going to continue questioning everything in my reality. Maybe one day, when I'm presented concrete proof of some magical pear floating and spinning in a void of nothingness, I'll jump aboard.
The whole point of science is to question your own reality. You really should investigate science. We have the best science. The greatest. It's wonderful science that everybody loves. Seriously.

Still waiting for that proof, btw. ;)
 
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signal

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Damn. You got me...
You seem very close-minded to behonest. It would be a waste of time for me to respond to all of your comments. Plus, you work for YYG.. what are you gonna do, say the world is flat??? Gimme me a break!
 

Nocturne

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You seem very close-minded to behones
Pot calling the kettle black? I have requested various times that you provide proof to back up your stance, the same as you have requested of me. I have provided proof, as have millions of others since the dawn of humanity, yet you have provided nothing. As a scientist (I may work for yoyo games now, but I was once a microbiologist, many moons ago...), I am CONSTANTLY questioning my reality and the basis of the science that underpins it, which is why I'm VERY interested in any proof you could provide that shows the contrary to the way I think and the things I know. Asking for proof is in itself proof that I have an open mind, unlike yourself, sadly, who ignores all reason and proof in favour of inane one-line smart-ass comments.

It would be a waste of time for me to respond to all of your comments.
I'd be happy if you actually just responded in a reasoned and logical way to just ONE of my comments!

Plus, you work for YYG.. what are you gonna do, say the world is flat??? Gimme me a break!
What does YYG have to do with anything???????? Just because I work for a company it means I don't have critical thinking and can't come up with my own ideas?????
 
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signal

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My senses tell me that the Earth is flat and motionless. I have not seen evidence to indicate otherwise.
 

HayManMarc

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My senses tell me that the Earth is flat and motionless. I have not seen evidence to indicate otherwise.
Your senses also tell you that there is no air, so there's no way you can be breathing right now. You just think you're breathing because you've been indoctrinated into thinking so. There is no such thing as breathing, because air really doesn't exist. It's a conspiracy by scientists to enslave people into thinking they need air to live. Open your eyes and use your senses and do your research! You can find it on the internet. It must be true because I just have a sneaky feeling about it.
 
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signal

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I can definitely feel the air enter my nostrils when inhaling. And I can feel the air when I exhale on my hand. I can also fan a hand in front of my face to create some wind. I know that I can't last for long without taking in a breath of air, and that I need to occasionally come up for more air when swimming underwater.

@Nocturne At this present time, I will depend on my senses. Thank you.
 

HayManMarc

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An individual observer cannot be certain air exists. No person has been to a 'vacuum' without it. What we know as "air" is simply the lack of water or solids occupying space. The sensation of breathing is filling oneself with energy itself. The lack of this energy makes one weak, which explains why we think we must breathe.
 

HayManMarc

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I can definitely feel the air enter my nostrils when inhaling. And I can feel the air when I exhale on my hand. I can also fan a hand in front of my face to create some wind.
How do you KNOW that wind is "air"? Wind is just the force of energy that moves around in empty space. Have you seen a scientist show a glass jar that supposedly has air next to one that he says is a "vacuum" without air? They look exactly the same. EXACTLY THE SAME. How can you explain that? If they're the same, how can they be different. It's a conspiracy.
 
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signal

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An individual observer cannot be certain air exists. No person has been to a 'vacuum' without it. What we know as "air" is simply the lack of water or solids occupying space. The sensation of breathing is filling oneself with energy itself. The lack of this energy makes one weak, which explains why we think we must breathe.
Even if I didn't know it's name or molecular composition, I would still be able to breath. In fact, my body knew how to breath straight out of the womb.. remarkable! Whether you call it energy, lack of a solid or air is irrelevant. The human body is programmed to breath.
 
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signal

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How do you KNOW that wind is "air"? Wind is just the force of energy that moves around in empty space. Have you seen a scientist show a glass jar that supposedly has air next to one that he says is a "vacuum" without air? They look exactly the same. EXACTLY THE SAME. How can you explain that? If they're the same, how can they be different. It's a conspiracy.
Here's the thing.. I don't care about science.. not one bit. Scientific study/research or whatever, isn't necessary for my survival.
 

HayManMarc

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Your indoctrination into believing in air is very complete, it would seem. Be careful that you are not manipulated by the "air-breathers" into accepting the lies of air and breathing. Just think about it. There's no such thing as "air".
 

Nocturne

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@Nocturne At this present time, I will depend on my senses. Thank you.
Sorry, but by your own admission you believe things, which has nothing to do with what your senses tell you...

@RichHopelessComposer I'm not claiming there is a creator. I'm saying I believe in creationism (keyword being believe).
Why do I believe in creation over evolution? 1) Evolution is only a theory 2) Because I choose to. I'm a human being. I make choices. I don't just regurgitate the popular belief because some lab coats say it is so.
Why do I not believe dinosaurs existed? Because there is no proof that they did.
Why do I believe the Earth is not a sphere? Because there is no proof that it is a sphere.
What you believe has no relevance to the world or reality. Only what you can PROVE, and so far you have proved nothing. However, I can prove (and can provide proof) for everything I say (note I don't "believe" in these things, I know these things).

Here's the thing.. I don't care about science.. not one bit. Scientific study/research or whatever, isn't necessary for my survival.
Our ancestors would never have survived without the discovery of the wheel, or fire, or astrology, or any number of other SCIENTIFIC breakthroughs. Someone had to watch lighting hit a branch and see the flame and think "how did that flame get there? What caused it? Can I make the flame?" and then they'd have to EXPERIMENT to discover how to make it themselves, and this was 500,000 years ago, all so you can sit here comfortable in your house with your SCIENTIFICALLY CREATED toys and commodities and say it's all made up crap. I'd like to see how well you survive butt naked on a mountain (or anywhere!) without using science to survive.
 
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signal

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You're making this more complicated then it is.. which is what science tends to do. Just open your mouth, take a gulp of "air" or whatever you want to call it and go on with your day.
 

HayManMarc

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You're making this more complicated then it is.. which is what science tends to do. Just open your mouth, take a gulp of "air" or whatever you want to call it and go on with your day.
How can I take a gulp of something that doesn't exist? Oh, wait. I think I know what you mean. Just accept it however it is and carry on as normal, right? Is that what you mean?
 
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signal

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Sorry, but by your own admission you believe things, which has nothing to do with what your senses tell you...
So now I'm not allowed to use my senses to formulate beliefs?
What you believe has no relevance to the world or reality. Only what you can PROVE, and so far you have proved nothing.
I have proven everything I need to prove to myself. I don't need to prove anything to you. That's on you and the life you choose to follow. I know it's hard to let go of that Star Wars. It's tough.
Our ancestors would never have survived without the discovery of the wheel, or fire, or astrology, or any number of other SCIENTIFIC breakthroughs. Someone had to watch lighting hit a branch and see the flame and think "how did that flame get there? What caused it? Can I make the flame?" and then they'd have to EXPERIMENT to discover how to make it themselves, and this was 500,000 years ago, all so you can sit here comfortable in your house with your SCIENTIFICALLY CREATED toys and commodities and say it's all made up crap. I'd like to see how well you survive butt naked on a mountain (or anywhere!) without using science to survive.
Great, so you believe in evolution. I don't And butt naked, on a mountain, I'd fare as well as the next guy and probably enjoy it more.
How can I take a gulp of something that doesn't exist? Oh, wait. I think I know what you mean. Just accept it however it is and carry on as normal, right? Is that what you mean?
Honestly, if you take such issue with breathing, just don't do it.. I really could care less.
 
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signal

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Those quotes say nothing about my receptiveness to new ideas. Cute bunny, though.
 

HayManMarc

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Honestly, if you take such issue with breathing, just don't do it.. I really could care less.
Are you saying you don't care if I'm dead? That's cold and heartless, dude. Seems like you don't appreciate my sense of logic as it pertains to "air". I don't understand why you would feel this way because there's absolutely no science involved with my hypothesis. It's just a hunch that could be possible, maybe. Right? Just because it's not accepted by the norm doesn't mean it's any less plausible to be true, right? Come on -- this is exactly what you've been telling everyone here, but now, all the sudden, you can't accept the same "logic" from someone else? Is it because the premise "air doesn't exist" seems too ridiculous to you? Can you not open your mind to the possibility, or is it just that you really do know the truth and you're just going against the grain to be rebellious to a society that you've decided has treated you unfairly at some point?

Real truth is probably the most valuable thing we can possess. I wish you peace and wellness in your life, @signal , and hope you find the truth, not only in the world around you, but within yourself.

07
 
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Nocturne

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signal

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Are you saying you don't care if I'm dead? That's cold and heartless, dude.
You were clearly being disingenuous. If you want to play pretend, sign up for a play or something. Or watch Star Trek movies.
I kinda hope he finds an education, but inner truth is fine too, I guess.
No thanks, you can save that indoctrination seat for yourself ;)
Yes, they do. I am challenging your ideas and presenting new ones to you and you are dismissing
Is everyone who doesn't share your beliefs close-minded? You do realize I'm past the whole NASA fanboy phase, right? Maybe one day you'll grow up, too. I'm hopeful, but doubtful.
 

ElectroMan

Jack of All Shades
Honestly, maths is a huge conspiracy dating back to Archimedes. I mean, "Pythagorean theorem"? It's right in the name, you dullards: it's not fact, it's just a theorem. I should know, I have a Masters in Physics.
 

Nocturne

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Maybe one day you'll grow up, too. I'm hopeful, but doubtful.
Oh! Ad-hominem attacks! Hit a nerve have I? Please refrain from personal attacks on the forums. I question your ideas and opinions, not you personally. ;)

Is everyone who doesn't share your beliefs close-minded?
No not in the least! I've had some most entertaining and enlightening talks with priests, physicists, buddhists, psychologists and any number of people! Many of them have challenged my world view and taught me things about the universe and about myself. This is why I request that you explain your beliefs and try to provide evidence for them other than "because I believe". I WANT to be challenged. I WANT to have my world view expanded. I WANT to be proven wrong and so grow as a person. From your replies so far it seems that you do not...

You do realize I'm past the whole NASA fanboy phase, right?
What does NASA have to do with any of this? I haven't once mentioned NASA.
 
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signal

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In your world, beliefs may be strict and unchangeable.. but I allow my beliefs to evolve.
 

Nocturne

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In your world, beliefs may be strict and unchangeable.. but I allow my beliefs to evolve.
Sigh... You haven't read a single word I've written have you?

No not in the least! I've had some most entertaining and enlightening talks with priests, physicists, buddhists, psychologists and any number of people! Many of them have challenged my world view and taught me things about the universe and about myself. This is why I request that you explain your beliefs and try to provide evidence for them other than "because I believe". I WANT to be challenged. I WANT to have my world view expanded. I WANT to be proven wrong and so grow as a person. From your replies so far it seems that you do not...
 
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signal

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Oh! Ad-hominem attacks! Hit a nerve have I? Please refrain from personal attacks on the forums. I question your ideas and opinions, not you personally. ;)
Wow, you sound so proud of yourself. What a great moderator. YYG is in good hands.
I WANT to be challenged. I WANT to have my world view expanded. I WANT to be proven wrong and so grow as a person. From your replies so far it seems that you do not...
Just becuase I haven't changed my beliefs to align with yours doesn't mean I don't want to grow! Get over yourself. You're not as smart as you think. Let go of that ego.
What does NASA have to do with any of this? I haven't once mentioned NASA.
My bad, I will refrain from mentioning anything tha tyou do not mention first, your royal hiighness.

Sigh... You haven't read a single word I've written have you?
That was a reply to the individual who posted before you.

Before this gets out of hand, like what are we even talking about here anymore? It feels like this went off the rails.
 
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Nocturne

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Wow, you sound so proud of yourself. What a great moderator. YYG is in good hands.
Another ad-hominem attack? What does my ability to do a job have to do with my personal opinions? Please do not call into doubt my abilities to do a job simply because I disagree with your opinion and respectfully request that you back it up. I am not dismissing your opinions, I'm only asking you to put your money where your mouth is... I am not asking you to do anything that I have not done already, as I have provided ample support for most of my comments. I don't think I'm being unreasonable here!

Just becuase I haven't changed my beliefs to align with yours doesn't mean I don't want to grow! Get over yourself. You're not as smart as you think. Let go of that ego.
Lol! I am not proposing that you change to my beliefs, I am proposing that you check the entire body of scientific evidence that proves certain things about the physical universe rather than blindly "believe" something. What I actually believe has nothing to do with this discussion, as I am not talking about belief, I am talking about knowledge. Also, I got over my ego a long time ago. Don't mistake confidence for arrogance. I have confidence in my abilities to defend my position and simply ask that you have the confidence to defend yours rather than attack me personally.

My bad, I will refrain from mentioning anything tha tyou do not mention first, your royal hiighness.
Oh dear... I haven't mentioned NASA anywhere in my posts, so it was a left-field call on your part to bring it into the conversation. I was questioning WHY you brought NASA into the conversation, since I hadn't brought it up and can't quite see what it has to do with anything discussed so far.

Before this gets out of hand, like what are we even talking about here anymore? It feels like this went off the rails.
We were discussing your belief that the earth is flat, that dinosaurs don't exist and that Creationism is a fact. As with most conversations, the horizons have broadened slightly since then and we are now talking about belief versus science in general and your inability to articulate any reasons for why you have your opinions other than that you believe them to be correct. :)
 
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signal

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I'm only asking you to put your money where your mouth is... I am not asking you to do anything that I have not done already, as I have provided ample support for most of my comments. I don't think I'm being unreasonable here!
As have I. If they are not to your liking, you are free to keep your own beliefs or research the ones I've presented further.
I am proposing that you check the entire body of scientific evidence that proves certain things about the physical universe
YAWN, I'm not into science-fiction
I was questioning WHY you brought NASA into the conversation, since I hadn't brought it up and can't quite see what it has to do with anything discussed so far.
Don't worry about it. NASA is just a dog-and-pony show anyway. We shouldn't bother with them.
We were discussing your belief that the earth is flat, that dinosaurs don't exist and that Creationism is a fact.
Oops! Try again. Actually, don't. You'll end messing it up again. Just go edit some articles that are in dire need of updating. That would probably be more helpful to the community. And we'll just leave this discussion as is because like I said earlier. I can't provide you with the illumination you're seeking.
 

Nocturne

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As have I.
Must have missed that! Can I have some links to the posts where you back-up your ideas please?

Oops! Try again. Actually, don't. You'll end messing it up again.
Umm....

your belief that the earth is flat,
Why do I believe the Earth is not a sphere? Because there is no proof that it is a sphere.
that dinosaurs don't exist
Why do I not believe dinosaurs existed? Because there is no proof that they did.
and that Creationism is a fact
Why do I believe in creation over evolution? 1) Evolution is only a theory 2) Because I choose to. I'm a human being. I make choices. I don't just regurgitate the popular belief because some lab coats say it is so.
:rolleyes:

Just go edit some articles that are in dire need of updating. That would probably be more helpful to the community. And we'll just leave this discussion as is because like I said earlier.
Striiiiiiiiiike three! Slightly more subtle ad-hominem attack, but still....

I can't provide you with the illumination you're seeking.
Nope, I'm beginning to think you can't... no matter how hard I try to get you to illuminate me with your ideas and reasons you seem to just ignore my requests and indulge in personal attacks. :(
 
Z

zendraw

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its true, priests had the comfort and time availible to seek god in the material, so they did. you need education so ideas can sprout in ur mind and outside the church the education was for labor and such. infact if relligion didnt banish these people, science now wuldnt be separate from relligion. and infact the reason these people were banished, was purely political, its aways political and i dont understand why no1 separates political relligion from cultist relligion(brainwash) from just relligion, where your just free to explore the spiritual, your freedom, your purpose, and so on. relligion and science can only enrich a man. but becouse of personal agande people like you guys just refuse to aknowledge. i mean today you can read any relligious book as freely as you can read a science article or w/e. you dont really n eed to get in some idiotic group, be it relligious or scientific. from my observation, for every relligious fan/fanatic, there is a science fan/fanatic or even 2 or 3 since science is more popular today. this desire to belong to a group seems to only make people more poor and angry then anything, and actual knowledge is as free as air...
 
S

signal

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Must have missed that! Can I have some links to the posts where you back-up your ideas please?
All along, I've maintained that my beliefs are simply that.. beliefs. If you feel the need to substantiate your own beliefs with science, that's on you. My beliefs don't require science, just the natural abilities (senses) that the creator gave me. They are working just fine for me without this science nonsense.

To reiterate: My senses tell me that the Earth is flat and motionless. I have not seen evidence to indicate otherwise.
So you're arguing that dinosaurs DO exist? There's a difference between fact and belief.. see if you can spot where you made the mistake in the part about Creationism. If you're going to quote someone, it would be nice if you didn't just change words around to suit your own argument. Then I may be more inclined not to make subtle ad-hominem attacks, as you call them.
Striiiiiiiiiike three! Slightly more subtle ad-hominem attack, but still....
Nope.. I was just ending our discussion and giving you a suggestion as to how your time might be better spent. There's numerous outdated GMS1.4 articles. That's not an attack, or an opinion, it's just fact.
Nope, I'm beginning to think you can't... no matter how hard I try to get you to illuminate me with your ideas and reasons you seem to just ignore my requests
I'm ignoring your requests because I don't have any desire to change your mind. Get over it. You keep asking for scientific proof because science is essentially your religion. That's not an attack either, you subscribe to the religion of science. If science can't back it up, it's fiction to you. The irony is that science is science-fiction.
 
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